Lower Linguals vs Ceramics - Help!

[Daveyboy]

Hi guys!

I had my upper STb linguals placed just over a week ago, and am now starting to get used to them. My tongue still gets bothered by them, epecially if I do a lot of talking, however it does seem to be getting better as time goes on so i'm hopeful to get to the stage where i dont really notice them.

I now have to decide whether to have lower linguals or lower ceramics?

I just can't see how the lowers will be anything but 10 times worse than the uppers as they'll be hitting the underneath of my tongue which is more sensitive. I have a small lower jaw which will be advanced with surgery in about 12months time, and so my tongue very much rests on the back of all of my lower teeth. My impression is that my tongue will CONSTANTLY be rubbing against all of the brackets, whether i'm talking/quiet/eating/kissing

How have people found the lower linguals compared to the top ones?

I am also thinking that you'll be able to see the lower linguals more than the upper ones?

Does anyone here have upper linguals/lower ceramics? And if so, which would you say are more comfortable?

Any help in deciding would be appreciated. Money isn't a huge consideration, although ceramics do work out slightly cheaper.

Cheers
Dave

[lionfish]

Daveyboy, I went through a similar dilemma to you. My (upper) linguals were placed first. I had 8 weeks in which to mull over whether to stick with my original choice (lower ceramics) or go fully lingual. At the end of the day, I decided to stick with ceramics on the bottom (actually only have 8 in front, the rest are metal).

It's hard to say whether one system would have been better than the other because they are so different, especially when placed on different arches.

It may have taken me a smidgin longer to adjust to the ceramics than to the linguals. They do feel quite bulky at first. Instead of having to deal with contact against your tongue, you are dealing with contact against the inside of your cheek and lower lip. All labial brackets can irritate this part of your mouth, but there are ways around this (wax and salt water rinses) and I've barely had any ill effects.

Hope this helps.

[antsika]

Hi Daveyboy, I have upper and lower linguals. I have also very narrow arches both upper and lower and my ortho warned me that it will be very uncomfortable to have linguals as i don't have too much space in my mouth. But I think it is ok. She was also afraid that I will not be able to clean them properly but she is suprised how well I am doing.
In my case the lower linguals don't bother me at all, didn't hurt my tongue as much as the uppers do, the uppers still cause me pain sometimes even after 4 months.
They cannot be seen at all for sure, noone noticed I have braces yet.
If money is not an issue I would advice the linguals but I know lots of people as lionfish have ceramics on the lowers so both is a good solution.
When I had to decide I thought why I have upper linguals if everybody can see the lowers? Even though money was important I decided to have lower linguals as well to have fully invisible braces, and I am happy with my decision.

[Andy82]

Hi daveyboy (and everyone else!),

I've had upper and lower linguals for 5 days now here's how i've found them:

Firstly I also have a narrow arch/small mouth and lingual's were an only option for me. Within 2 minutes of having the lowers fitted my tongue caught the end arch wire so that wasn't a good start, even now i still have bad ulcers on both sides of my tongue and can't get by without wax on both sides. If it helps i haven't had to use way on any of the top or front lower brackets.

I'm lisping pretty bad mind, mainly with 's' and 'ce' sounds, probably because i have been avoiding using certain words or even talking altogether! I'm hoping to notice an improvement in this respect soon but guess i just need to talk more!

My biggest problem has been eating. I'd imagine it will be quite different for you once you've your lowers fitted. My molars are a fair way off touching as my lower front teeth hit off the upper brackets. I'm sick of the soft food diet, i can't chew or bite at all, been living on soup with bread (can't even manage the soggy crusts! have cut them off!), noodles (which are a challenge), tuna mixed with loads of mayo, smoothies and yoghurts. Not ideal - i could murder a fillet steal...

Another major problem is that (without sounding minging) i an unable to spit! Without going into detail it's not very easy or pleasant. Just even for after brushing my teeth, but maybes others don't have this problem?

Have you adjusted well to everything so far then davey?

Overall i'm feeling a lot better than the first few days and am getting quicker at cleaning and applying wax. Just over 103 weeks left

i'd kind of agree with antsika, you've opted for upper lingual's originally so why go for lower ceramic's on the bottom?

Andy

[Daveyboy]

Hi Andy,

Thanks for the response and I hope your tongue gets used to them soon.

I have to say that overall i'm happy with my uppers, i'm now at the stage of only using wax once every couple of days, and only on 2 teeth that are tipped quite far inwards.... see my first post here for pics viewtopic.php?t=14377

Please keep this post updated, maybe in another few days and let me know how things settle down?

When my tongue was getting used to the uppers, it felt like it was on fire, but now less than 2 weeks later it is almost fine.

I've got a few considerations to think about..... one being that i'm probably having lower advancement surgery in 12 months, and that I dont know how i'll cope having my mouth shut for a week or two if i've got both upper and lower linguals. Having said that, it's only a week or two and in the big scheme of things.... thats nothing!

My lower teeth are currently far back from my lower lip and so the only lower labial brackets that would touch would be the ones at the back, that i would guess would be more comfortable than lower linguals.

I take on board the comments about why may for upper linguals, and get visible lower ceramics, and so maybe I should just go for the lower linguals... give it a month to adjust and if it does cause me real problems... then change to lower ceramics!

As you can probably tell, i've rambled on a bit as this have been on my mind since getting the uppers fitted!

Cheers!
Dave

[AG]

Hello Daveboy,

I have upper lingual ibraces and bottom ceramic braces. If I had to choose now, I would choose lingual top and bottom, I think they are more confortable (ibraces than ceramics), and totally invisible. Anyway, I´ll continue with my bottom ceramics. But I´m really-really happy with my upper linguals.

Hope it helps.

[brady]

Daveyboy-

Read your last message - I'm still not braced - awaiting my upper linguals from Germany, but the plan is that I will have upper linguals and ceramic lowers. My ortho has said tho that due to my overbite, the uppers may hit the lowers, which could cause tooth damage, so we may need to either use material to build up on my molars to help avoid this interference OR use metal brackets on the lower, since they are smaller than the ceramics. I have to say, I'm not too excited about using metal on the lowers...

Anyway, I'm curious to know what your choice is and if you have an overbite, how your choice is working out in terms of interference between the uppers and lowers. Please post an update.

Thanks,
Brady

[Daveyboy]

Hello Everyone,

So i've still got a couple of days left to decide whether to go with lower linguals or ceramics...... and I still haven't made a decision!!

I think there's just too many different pro's and cons to decide!

Here are my concerns:

Elastics - my ortho hasn't mentioned elastics, and I gather that normally if you have surgery, then elastics to correct your bite generally aren't needed? How would elastics work if i've got upper linguals and lower ceramics?

Visibility - I am worried about looking in the mirror everyday and seeing even the ceramics.

Eating - I'm taking a guess that eating will be easier with lower ceramics as they'll be on the outside of what my tongue is trying to do, and where all the food will be.

Brushing - Ceramics will suffer with lig stains, and it'll be more imperative that I brush after every meal esp to avoid this. With the lower linguals it won't be quite so important, so long as I brush v thoroughly as soon as I get the chance - and i wont have to worry about food staining the ligs.

I'm having lower advancement surgery - and am worried about being very swollen with both upper and lower linguals pressing into my tongue (which will prob also be swollen) however, this is only for a couple of weeks, so not a huge concern.


If anyone has any more advice then please let me know! I know that i'll be less stressed once I finally make a decision!!

I have been told by my ortho that if I did go for the linguals, and within 2 months they're still unbearable then I could swap for ceramics, so i'm very tempted to go for this..... what would you do???

Oh, and the ceramics i could have are from http://www.invu-ortho.com/

Any suggestions / feedback would be very welcome!

Cheers
Dave

[antsika]

Hard question to decide, Daveyboy! The worst is you cannot try them on before making the decision

Like KK said, I don't have ceramics only linguals, so I cannot make a comparison but try to answer your questions which relate to linguals.
Elastics - I just started to use them 2 weeks ago, you can check it out in my story how they work. It is not an issue, it can be used with linguals as well, the buttons the elastics attached to are a bit visible but I got used to them quite quickly.
Eating - I only have problems with eating only when my teeth are sore but it not depends on the kind of the brackets.
Brushing - my ortho was worried about how I will be able to clean the brackets especially on the lower front teeth because there is so small space but she is satisfied with it so far.

When I needed wax at the beginning I needed them on the upper arch mainly so I suppose the lower are not in the way as much.

It is a very good opportunity what your ortho has offered that if you can't take the linguals you can change to ceramics so I think this means you cannot lose anyway, doesn't it?

I hope you will make a decision which one you are going to be happy with!

[lionfish]

Elastics - my ortho hasn't mentioned elastics, and I gather that normally if you have surgery, then elastics to correct your bite generally aren't needed? How would elastics work if i've got upper linguals and lower ceramics?

Visibility - I am worried about looking in the mirror everyday and seeing even the ceramics.

Eating - I'm taking a guess that eating will be easier with lower ceramics as they'll be on the outside of what my tongue is trying to do, and where all the food will be.

Brushing - Ceramics will suffer with lig stains, and it'll be more imperative that I brush after every meal esp to avoid this. With the lower linguals it won't be quite so important, so long as I brush v thoroughly as soon as I get the chance - and i wont have to worry about food staining the ligs.

If anyone has any more advice then please let me know! I know that i'll be less stressed once I finally make a decision!!

I have been told by my ortho that if I did go for the linguals, and within 2 months they're still unbearable then I could swap for ceramics, so i'm very tempted to go for this..... what would you do???

Oh, and the ceramics i could have are from http://www.invu-ortho.com/

Dave,

As you know, I've got lower ceramics.

To anchor my box elastics, my ortho glued ceramic buttons to the outside of all my upper premolars. There are hooks on the opposing lower braces, so away I went. For a short while I was in another formation from upper canine to lower canine/incisor. He attached 4 metal hooks, 2 to the wire on my upper canines, and another 2 to the wire on my lower incisors (there is a standard hook on the ceramic on my lower canines). So there are various ways of anchoring elastics with lingual/ceramic configs.

Ceramics are only really visible at very close range, and more so if people are looking at you side on. The people who have spotted and commented on mine have been sitting on top of me. I'm not at all concerned about looking at them in the mirror.

As far as eating goes, food still gets trapped in ceramics. I don't think linguals would have been any better or worse.

Yes, certain ligs will stain with ceramics. I gave up with the clear ligs a while back because I was sick of the gungy look of them. I'm simply not prepared to modify my diet to accommodate this. So I'm now in mauve ligs which are not that much more noticeable than clear, and they are able to withstand all the foods that stain.

What would I do? Go with with what you think will make you happy.

[Daveyboy]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for all of your responses, much appreciated!!

I have just emailed my ortho and said that i'd like to go with the linguals.

I think that IF I can get used to them, then I'll be happier overall for the 1.5 yrs that this is going to take (finger crossed!)

I don't know if they'll be comfortable enough for me to get used to them, but if I don't try then I wont know!!!

I'll post some pics up next week when I get them fitted

Apart from this stressful decision, most things have been going well. I've seen some good movement in my teeth in the past month, and just hope that i'll be as happy with my choice of lower linguals, as I have done with my upper ones!!

Thanks again to everyone on this site, especially those who post often.... it doesn't go unnoticed, and I'm sure everyone including me appreciates this board a huge deal!!

See ya'll!

[antsika]

Hi Daveyboy, congrats for finally making the decision, I hope you feel better now! Good luck for the lower linguals, I hope you are going to be satisfied with them! Just take your time after the B-day, give your tongue and speech some time to get used to them!

Awaiting your pics!

[lionfish]

Glad you've made your decision, dave. I'm sure you'll be fine.

[BlahBlah]

Well i couldnt decide either for my bottom so i went for the 6 front ones linguals and the back teeth ceramics becos u cant really see them

aye guys.. just a question with the ceramics, how do they actually work??? I haven't seen much but from what i remember its just a wire across the teeth, is there anything attached on the back???? Any brackets on the teeth?????

[lionfish]

Ceramic brackets work the same as linguals, only they're attached to the front of the teeth. There's nothing behind mine.

I'm very interested to hear how your combination linguals/ceramics on your lower arch works out, how many wires you get and how they work. Keep us posted.