Ever felt crooked teeth held you back in life (pre-braces)?

[Marguerite]

I happen to agree with Jackie, although she expressed no controversial opinions and merely made a few common sense remarks. Let me paraphrase what I have gathered from the many posts opposing her:

"Smile! Be happy! Travel the world! Everybody loves everyone else! Everyone is beautiful! No one judges anyone else. You can do anything you set your mind to! There is absolutely no correlation between income and optional dental treatments!"

Right.

This line of thinking is generally abandoned after kindergarten, when most people realize the world is a horribly cruel place where not only will you be judged for your crooked teeth, but every possible sign of weakness, visible or invisible, up to and including regional accents, weight distribution, hairstyle, table manners, walking, and the list goes on. This is a hard reality for many people to grasp, and if you would like to go on living in a halcyon second childhood of rainbows and butterflies, well, knock yourself out.

This is what makes life the way it is. The poor, the ugly, and the stupid are necessary not only for the enjoyment but the very definition of the wealthy, the beautiful, and the intelligent.

Welcome to the Jungle.

[lionfish]

I happen to agree with Jackie, although she expressed no controversial opinions and merely made a few common sense remarks. Let me paraphrase what I have gathered from the many posts opposing her:

"Smile! Be happy! Travel the world! Everybody loves everyone else! Everyone is beautiful! No one judges anyone else. You can do anything you set your mind to! There is absolutely no correlation between income and optional dental treatments!"

Right.

Not entirely.

None of us is suggesting that the world is a perfect place. Of course people judge others. The issue is how to separate what is important to be judged on, and what is not. Other perhaps than in the UK where the NHS affords treatment to all on the basis of need, there are plenty of people out there for whom dental treatment is not possible. By the same token, there are also plenty who can afford treatment but choose not to take it up. This is not the same as saying that crooked teeth are a marker of social class; they are not. Go to Africa - the most impoverished continent on earth - and you will see plenty of people with straight teeth.

This line of thinking is generally abandoned after kindergarten, when most people realize the world is a horribly cruel place where not only will you be judged for your crooked teeth, but every possible sign of weakness, visible or invisible, up to and including regional accents, weight distribution, hairstyle, table manners, walking, and the list goes on. This is a hard reality for many people to grasp, and if you would like to go on living in a halcyon second childhood of rainbows and butterflies, well, knock yourself out.

You can choose to be a victim or you can cultivate a positive attitude and get on with your life. Trust me, I've tried both in my time and found the former is definitely the less attractive option.

This is what makes life the way it is. The poor, the ugly, and the stupid are necessary not only for the enjoyment but the very definition of the wealthy, the beautiful, and the intelligent.

Welcome to the Jungle.

Excuse me??

[wired after 50]

I started reading this post and realized if I wanted to go to bed this week I had better skip ahead.

I have always wanted to get mine straightened but my father did not believe in it and even though as an army brat I could have gotten them free in late 60's/early 70's my father was against it. SO I went through life with horrible crooked bottom teeth. I have worked my self from an entry level bank position to a manager all without a college degree. I married a man with beautiful naturally straight teeth. And have three sons who take after their father in the teeth department.

At 51 I had TMJ so bad I would wake up crying at night. When I went to my dentist he said my bottom teeth were so crooked that a night guard would not work for me and recommended an orthodontist. That is why I entered into the journey into braces.

The funny thing about this is that most of my friends and co-worker were shocked when I got braces because they said they always thought I had great teeth. My front bottom teeth were like popcorn kernels. They were all over the place. I read an article not long ago that says that adults who correct crooked teeth are less likely to have dentures. That and getting rid of the TMJ make all this worth it. The straight teeth are just an add on.

I don't think straighter teeth would have gotten me any further in life nor made me any happier.

[SueFromNJ]

Marguerite, thanks for sharing, I understand everything you wrote!

And once again, any contrary opinion or experience is criticized line by line by the same small group of frequent posters, as they encourage and slap each other on the back. Sigh.

It's sad to read this thread - we are all supposedly in the same boat by getting braces, and we're from all over the world and from many different societies, yet a small group here insist their view is ALL that matters.

[ohmyjaw]

I think this is one of those situations where the truth lies somewhere in between.

When I set out to get braces I had a hard time coming to terms with my own vanity. I would often lie in bed at night thinking, "How did I get to this point? I am going to spend thousands of dollars, have my jaw broken, and maybe get a couple of fake teeth, all because I can't accept my physical appearance. Does this make me a weak person or what?!"

Well, here I am two years later, jaw surgery done, braces coming off in about six months. Am I glad I did it? Absolutely. I feel like a different person. I wake up in the morning feeling confident and ready to face the world. However, I know that I have to also invest in the person inside, because that inner person is really the only thing that's going to make it or break it for me in this life.

[dubnobass]

This is a highly emotive subject. Unsurprisingly, then, people express their opinions with force when they disagree. I don't think anyone has been rude or forceful, or put anyone else down. Just disagreed. Not every discussion is going to be sunshine and lollipops.

I find this whole discussion particularly bizarre because as I've said elsewhere in the thread, in Britain "jacked up teeth" are the absolute norm. There is no correlation between money and orthodonture because everyone qualifies for free orthodontic treatment (if required) anyway. Even as an adult, if you need treatment according to a pre-specified list of criteria (and if you have class II or III malocclusion, you qualify), you can get free treatment.

There's just very little interest in dentistry here and it's quite common for people not to even have check-ups, lat alone seek out orthodontic treatment. I have friends who haven't been to a dentist in 10 years.

To then read in this thread all about how people judge you on your teeth, and how only poor people of low class have crooked teeth.. both are factually incorrect in my country. So many people have terrible teeth here that people really don't judge you on it. Anyone who needs it can get free treatment, so money and class are not an issue either, and people who are rich with high-flying jobs are just as likely to have bad teeth as people on the dole.

If this situation is different on different continents, then so be it - but I can't agree with 'facts' which do not apply here. I get the feeling they do not apply in Oz/NZ, or in mainland Europe either. So, in fact, they seem to apply mainly in the US, which means the majority of posters share the US view, because most people here are American.. but the US view is not the norm for the rest of the planet.

[lionfish]

Marguerite, thanks for sharing, I understand everything you wrote!

And once again, any contrary opinion or experience is criticized line by line by the same small group of frequent posters, as they encourage and slap each other on the back. Sigh.

It's sad to read this thread - we are all supposedly in the same boat by getting braces, and we're from all over the world and from many different societies, yet a small group here insist their view is ALL that matters.

I'm not sure that the group to whom you refer is as small as you think. And I don't recall any of us insisting that our view is all that matters. It seems you'd prefer that we remain silent.

Yes, we are here for a common purpose, but that doesn't mean we're all made the same. Dubnobass puts the geographical differences in proper context. Certainly in Aussie and New Zealand, no-one gives a rat's a**e about straight teeth. And as has been so clearly demonstrated here, plenty of people have been able to make a life for themselves without having had to sort their teeth first or ever.

I can see nothing inflammatory in saying this.

[joney]

I completely agree with Dubnobass with regard to the UK and attitudes to teeth.

Also, Marguerite, what on earth did you mean by the statement below?

The poor, the ugly, and the stupid are necessary not only for the enjoyment but the very definition of the wealthy, the beautiful, and the intelligent.

Also if it were true about looks and self esteem / success then the most successful people in the world would be the best looking ones. This is clearly not the case as many beautiful people have low self esteem and lots of people who are not so beautiful have high self esteem.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with wanting to improve your looks and if it causes self esteem issues then I would say go for it. And it is true that first impressions count - but only for a short while.

[MetalMouse]

Before I got braces (2nd time), I wasn't insecure because of my teeth and crookedness. However, having straight teeth WITH braces now I'd say I'm more confident. On the other hand, having braces now lowers my confidence when meeting new people, but I think I'm usually over-exaggerating. Either way, after surgery + braces + whitening in about a year, I am predicting that I will have a huge confidence boost, and I am very much looking forward to it

[jackie100]

Wow, just found this thread. I don't know if the OP is still reading, but I agree with everything she wrote 100%.

I assume the OP is American, probably from a city area or middle class or suburban neighborhood.

Hi Sue, yes, I'm still reading

Also, I'm from Orange County which is located in Southern California, supposedly land of all the "beautiful people", not too far away from L.A so obviously people are really into looks and physical appearances.

Dumbnobass, yes, when I was voicing my opinion I was mainly stating from my point of view of how it is in America, it might be very well be totally different in England. However, I was reading an article awhile ago about Kate Middleton and how some of the rich English girls all get sent to the same orthodontist in London or something similar. It was about how today's "Sloan Woman" is different from before etc.

[jackie100]

So how is it that people such as Kai Peters and Guy Verhofstadt have done so well?

Well, those are males, unfortunately standards of beauty are higher for women. I would think it's harder for women to become successful with teeth like that. It's not as hard as guys as for women I think, and I am only stating my point of view from a woman's perspective.

If a woman has messed up teeth, I think that severely limits her chances of finding a mate too, even if she IS sucessful. Women tend to be more forgiving about looks than men, they don't care as much if a guy has messed up teeth, but guys are much pickier.

[Kerridwen]

When I got my first braces off, my teeth did not look good at all (my jaws are too small, my teeth are generally too big and my old ortho didn't extract any of them).

He left me with a huge huge overbite, I didn't have it before but I didn't care much...until my wisdom teeth came in. That's where it became unbearable for me. (I soon developed an extreme deep bite, it hurt real bad)

I tried to never smile and gosh, that's no fun at all. I even hated when people looked at me closely while talking...because I knew they could see there's something wrong with my teeth. I hope they won't stare at my braces (soon I'm gonna have my uppers braced, so far I only had my lowers done) all the time but even if they do, I am SURE that I'm gonna be able to handle it much better instead knowing that they are looking at horrible looking teeth.

[Salacia]

but guys are much pickier.

Not all guys focus so single-mindedly on outward appearance. But I think I might have said that many many posts ago. And several of us have spoken up, holding up ourselves as examples of less than "California gorgoeous" and yet having wonderful relationships with fantastic blokes.

As to Sloan Rangers - they are something of a joke among many populations in the UK - considered pretentious and often rather thick - so not a shining example.

I agree wholeheartedly with Meryaten.

Here in Ireland, as in England, people simply don't get worked up over the appearance of your teeth. Many people of my acquaintance think that I'm being pointlessly vain getting braces in the first place!

If my teeth put a man - any man - off from dating me, then I would consider that to be to my benefit as it has saved me from an unsatifactory liason with a shallow arsehole.

[valster]

To then read in this thread all about how people judge you on your teeth, and how only poor people of low class have crooked teeth.. both are factually incorrect in my country. So many people have terrible teeth here that people really don't judge you on it. Anyone who needs it can get free treatment, so money and class are not an issue either, and people who are rich with high-flying jobs are just as likely to have bad teeth as people on the dole.

Well, as you said, context is everything.

The UK just has different criteria for judging others. No matter what their teeth may look like, if you compare someone who dresses and speaks like the Vicky Pollard character to Nigella Lawson...

[dubnobass]

Well, as you said, context is everything.

The UK just has different criteria for judging others. No matter what their teeth may look like, if you compare someone who dresses and speaks like the Vicky Pollard character to Nigella Lawson...

Oh, absolutely. I didn't say the UK doesn't judge you, I just said it doesn't judge you on your teeth ..but that's not what the issue was here.