Orthos & PK's

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#16 Post by **breal87** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 3:46 pm

and gabi, i don't think you sound like a "junkie" at all. You have every reason to take a stronger medication for pain when needed. It is not good to be taking 2-4 ibuprofens everyday when 1 vicodin/percocet will do the trick

thanks for everyone's comments on this topic

#17 Post by **Miss Smiley** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 4:01 pm

markuhde wrote:For the TMJ I can understand the mild narcotics, I know that's very severe functional pain. I was under the mistaken impression that they were for orthodontic pain. For ortho pain, narcotics would be insanely overkill. I just know what those drugs can do to a person... and it's incredibly scary.

Meryaten, I'm sorry but I cannot imagine narcotics EVER being appropriate for pain from braces. They're incredibly dangerous, mind-altering drugs.

Before you argue with me, do you think it would ever be appropriate to provide a more "traditional" (say 10-16 year old) orthodontic patient with narcotics? I didn't think so... And it shouldn't be different for us because we're a little older.

Markuhde - I think you can speak for yourself when you say mild narcotic painkillers should not be for any orthodontic patients. I can tell you that I did not need any painkillers besides a regular dosage of OTC ibuprofen for my wisdom tooth extraction. But there have been some nights where my teeth ached so bad [from ortho pain] I couldn't sleep longer than a couple of hours. I needed Codeine just to get through the night or take half of a Vicodin because the Rx ibuprofen wasn't working. Just because one doesn't feel it physically necessary, does not mean that others have the same pain threshold.

Granted that the drugs can cause adverse reactions including addiction, does not mean that they can not and should not be used. People generally don't use pain medication if it is unecessary. Much like people with healthy or normal bowel movements and alike don't take a laxative on a daily basis just because it feels good. They take it because they need it.

#18 Post by **breal87** » Wed Feb 06, 2008 4:53 pm

The only time I got pain killers prescribed for mouth pain was when I got all 4 of my wisdom teeth extracted and I actually ended up getting dry socket in my bottom holes which was really the most painful/uncomfortable thing ever.

it is really not so much the movement of my teeth that hurt, it was the cuts that the brackets and wires would make in my mouth. I would usually just deal with the pain and suffer, sometimes wax is not the solution but ibuprofen usually did the trick

#19 Post by **markuhde** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:32 am

How many teenagers and kids have all those things. Would you dream of prescribing THEM narcotics?

Enough said.

Our society has enough problems as it is. Even if 80% of people prescribed these drugs WON'T abuse them and WON'T lose their mind because of them, I think the risk is far too high after what I saw my friend's dad do to his family. The drugs totally changed him.

And I have got off relatively light myself, I'll acknowledge that. No surgery, no extractions (NOT EVEN MY WISDOM TEETH!!! All my teeth are small so I prolly have room for them

YAY!!!), no expanders. Brackets and wires and powerchains so far. I'm looking forward to elastics

#20 Post by **Lisa65** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:32 am

So would you therefore have alcohol totally banned, because some people can't be trusted to drink responsibly?

#21 Post by **breal87** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:05 pm

Well said Meryaten

#22 Post by **Miss Smiley** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:18 pm

Like Mer I have been prescribed many drugs which can be addictive and know of others who have too. BUT that didn't create an addiction for us. We merely used it enough to serve it's purpose. Example, I was on Xanax for PTSD, Vicodin for a tear in my ACL, Codeine for my womanly cramps but I only took them when necessary (in enough pain to not go to work, difficulty walking, causing enough anxiety to not drive, etc.) I have not taken anymore xanax and did not ask for a refill and I was on the lowest dosage, per my request to the doctor. I only used it when needed and did not abuse it. My cousin has morphine from her surgery but only took one to get through the first night at home. She has the rest in her cabinet. My mom was prescribed mood altering drugs for her anxiety and for when she was going through menopause, but she's not addicted, she didn't use her entire script. A good friend was prescribed a mood enhancer without being warned of the chance of addiction and has been weaned off with no other issues. She was on the prescription for 2-3 years and wanted to be taken off and did so under the authority of her doctor as to not suffer any ill side effects from withdrawal. She would have never agreed to the medication in the first place if she knew there wasa good chance of addiction, especially since she was prescribed to take it daily.

These were not medications prescribed to us all willy nilly. Doctors prescribed these strong medications because we were out of hemeopathic options and over the counter pharmacy drugs were not cutting it. Not because we had nothing to do and wanted narcotics. Anyhow, the painkillers received were for short term use and not something intended for long term use.

#23 Post by **markuhde** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 3:50 pm

My friend's dad, not my dad's friend. I forgot the name of the drug but he got totally addicted to it while on it. I also have a friend who basically went insane while on Accutane (if you haven't heard of it it's an acne drug that basically makes you go insane... suicide is actually a listed potential side effect

).

Our society is so over medicated it makes me sick. We even medicate the water! (with fluoride).

I'm not saying medicine is never appropriate and I'm not judging anyone. I'm warning people in love of what I've seen. I don't consider them lesser people for using the drugs. I pray that they *don't* suffer the same effects I have had the misfortune of seeing.

#24 Post by **jennielee81** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 4:44 pm

My MIL was given oxycodone for knee pain about 8 years ago. She's so addicted to it now and her doc (not sure I like this guy) just keeps giving it to her in HUGE amounts.

When she was in the hospital for unrelated surgery, they wouldn't give it to her and she was having severe chills and vomiting. She got home and started taking them again and is "fine". Though she's not the same woman she was before they became a problem for her.

She never intended to become addicted to them! Poor thing, now she's unable/unwilling to go through what is needed to get off of them.

It's clear that no one posting here has an addiction to their meds. THANK GOODNESS! But it does happen to perfectly normal people when they're just trying to go about their lives.

I was given this same drug when I broke my collar bone a few years ago, I hated the way it made me feel so I put it away. My MIL saw it in the cabinet and asked if she could buy it from me!!

I told her it was expired and when she said she didn't care I dumped it down the toilet.

Please don't think I am judging, demonizing, labeling, or categorizing anyone here or anywhere on the planet. I am just sharing a story of a woman who was overprescribed medication for a condition that could have been better delt with.

#25 Post by **Miss Smiley** » Fri Feb 08, 2008 5:10 pm

Jennie - Sorry to hear that you MIL had a careless doctor who seems to have just thrown her pills. I hope she is doing better and it seems like with the support of her loving family, she will continue to do well.

I have a cousin who is on accutane and doing very well. She has not suffered any side effects and her doctor follows her progress on a regular basis. He does not just give her a script for however long and lets her refill them. He actually monitors her and makes her come in every month.

Much like painkillers, when a doctor gives me a script, they usually give me just a few and they monitor when my last script was and such. I can usually make 15 Vicodin or codeine last me well over until the meds have been long expired. It's not like people should carelessly pop them into the mouth because "That's how often the bottle says to take the pain killers." You take them as needed, not just because the bottle says you can.

#26 Post by **Miss Smiley** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:29 pm

markuhde wrote:My friend's dad, not my dad's friend. I forgot the name of the drug but he got totally addicted to it while on it. I also have a friend who basically went insane while on Accutane (if you haven't heard of it it's an acne drug that basically makes you go insane... suicide is actually a listed potential side effect ).

I just wanted to post this about Accutane because depression is listed as a side effect but at the least common side effect.
http://www.aocd.org/skin/dermatologic_d ... utane.html

I think even my hormone pills list depression as a side effect. Work should come with a warning label "May cause extreme stress, loss of hair, sleeplessness, strong desire to kill superiors, lethargy and unstable outcomes."

#27 Post by **Lisa65** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:45 pm

Having my mother to stay causes similar symptoms.

May cause extreme stress, loss of hair, sleeplessness, strong desire to kill superiors, lethargy and unstable outcomes."

#28 Post by **Miss Smiley** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:02 am

Hahaha so then we should ban those too? Let's ban the use of hormones, birth control, mother-in-laws, and anything else that may alter our state of mind and drive us insane. =P

#29 Post by **gabi** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 6:27 pm

I am afraid of becoming addicted to Vicodin. I am hypersensitive about the subject and take things personally. I feel like I need to share this thought with you, since you are all passionate and caring people.

I have been carefully monitoring myself with respect to my use of Vicodin. I had been taking it about every 2 days until about 2 weeks ago. I had starting needing it everyday due to jaw pain. It stressed me, the fear of addiction, so I stopped. I was ok for a day or two then suddenly, two days ago, I had pain so horrible that I decided that I would take V as much as I needed to, as often as I needed to, with disreguard to addiction issues. I am filled with fear that I will become addicted, but at the same time, realizing that if I don't get this pain under control, more final solutions become more appealing. So which is worse? severe depression or mild addiction? When is it justified to allow yourself to become addicted? Is it ok when you believe that once your source of chronic pain is eliminated, you will be able to detox? Can fear keep you from becoming addicted? Yes, I am scheduling an appt with my Dr to discuss my pain management options, but I'm curious what ya'll's thoughts are.

#30 Post by **Miss Smiley** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 12:27 pm

Necessity of medication for a chronic condition that can not be cured in other ways is justifiable. Living in pain and not being able to function in day to day activities is worse than managing chronic pain with the use of medications.