Herbst device at 39 Anyone?

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#1 Post by **glamcat99** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 5:32 pm

A little background. I am now 22 months into treatment and my bite is still horrible. I have a rather large overjet. I tried to wear elastics, but didn't keep up with it due to my TMJ jaw pain. My ortho decided a herbst would be the best way to go. I am now 3 days in and my jaw pain is much more severe than it was with the elastics.

My ortho is not the talkative type so I usually have to ask questions and get info from the assistants. One of the assistants put on the herbst and had never done it before so that in itself was a bit scary. The ortho did check it and said it looked good. First I am just getting frustrating not knowing more about what is going on in my mouth and I don't understand what this herbst is going to do? I searched the net and it looks as though it is meant for kids still growing to help lower jaw growth. As an adult what will this do for me other than cause me massive pain?

If anyone has had this or has info on the herbst for treatment in adults I would be so greatful. I am ready to pull this thing out myself! I am taking pain killers around the clock and I am really not sure I can cope. This is so much worse then when I had my braces first put on.

Thanks if you made it this far. Sorry this got so long!

#2 Post by **Braceschris** » Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:10 pm

I have the herbest appliance, however I use it for Sleep Apnea. I have maxed out the screws and I use three rubber bands on each side. It moves my lower jaw out at night. I go for a sleep study tommrow to check and make sure that it is doing what it is suppose to be. I do have some discomfort but not often. I wish you good luck and keep us up dated on how you are doing.

Chris

#3 Post by **newbie** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 11:54 am

I'm 39 also and getting a herbst in a couple of weeks. Did you end up getting one? How did it work out?

#4 Post by **kvs2800** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:14 pm

So sorry to hear about the discomfort. From pictures I've seen, it looks like a torture device.

During my initial consultation I was told I may have to have a herbst as a last resort if elastics don't do 100% of the work needed with my overbite. From what the ortho said to me, he would use the herbst in order to "train my jaw muscles" in a new way. Not sure if this is true for you, but just my ortho's explanation.

Good luck!

#5 Post by **Braceschris** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 7:07 am

I have had the herbst device for a year now. I wear it just about everynight. I change the rubber bands about once a month. I use about 3-4 on each side. I had a sleep study back in Sept. and the device does help with my sleep apena. I usally wear it for about 4-6 hours a night. I have found that it does wake me at night sometimes and I just take it out. For me it pushes my lower jaw out. I do notice a little shift if I do not wear it for a few days. I do not mind the device at all.

Chris

#6 Post by **thesallymonster** » Thu Jan 22, 2009 11:56 pm

I had the Herbst appliance on for about a year, and I got it off last August.

In adults, I guess the Herbst is supposed to push your top molars back (kinda like headgear) to create enough space to eventually push your top front teeth back.

You can expect a LOT of discomfort with the Herbst for the first couple weeks, I know I did! Though I wasn't in a lot of pain, I had a lot of trouble chewing food at first because my back teeth didn't meet when I tried to chew. Of course, everyone's experience is different.

I really disliked having the Herbst appliance the entire time, but that was mostly because of having to clean around it, and the fact that it would get stuck if I opened my mouth too wide. It did it's job, though, and now I'm dealing with other treatment issues.

My advice would be that if you continue to be in a lot of pain after a couple more weeks, call your ortho. The Herbst is enough of a torture device when it doesn't hurt!

#7 Post by **Grinandbearit** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:28 am

I just had a herbst installed to treat my TMJ. I'm less than a week in, but so far, even with the discomfort of the raw spots on my cheeks, and the eating problems (both of which will hopefully go away soon) I MUCH prefer the herbst over the splint I was wearing.

I know its strange to hear, given what others have said, but my splint affected my speech, even after 6 weeks, and didn't resolve all of my pain.

I hope you feel better soon!.

Grin and bear it

#8 Post by **newbie** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:01 pm

Grinandbearit,

How goes it with the Herbst? Are you able to eat now?

I have 1/2 of the Herbst installed yesterday. I can't shut my jaws all the way and my cheeks are killing me.

Can you give me some hope?

#9 Post by **Grinandbearit** » Sat Feb 07, 2009 6:50 pm

I had the Herbst installed on a tuesday morning, by friday my cheeks were healing. about a week later my back teeth were touching again.
Eating is...time consuming. There is no side to side movement. Lots of mashing, not much grinding. small bits of food seem to be key. Larger chunks end up getting between the arms of the herbst, and your cheeks.
My biggest problem now, 3 weeks in, is cleaning up after eating. Flossing is right out. Walmart sells dental picks though, which works nicely.

So now, I can say, no pain. Well, very little TMJ pain, and no pain from the herbst. Its not visible (if that matters to you) and doesn't affect my speech.

Grinandbearit

#10 Post by **scrabblemlhook** » Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:36 pm

yesterday bottom half of Mr. Herbst installed
one crown was not properly seated
I could not chew as the bar was being chomped on
I went back in today to get it cut in half and that side reglued.
My attitude improved 100% as now I knew I would not have to eat pureed foods until my next 6 week visit! They did not look surprised to see me back because they knew it wasn't a good connection. I had the spacers for 3 weeks and when they were removed the technician noticed they needed to be there longer because they might have trouble installing....Yup! I was in the chair 2 hours yesterday and 1 hour today. Now I just get to deal with the normal excruciating pain while eating for the next week or so. I wonder how many canker sores I will get with this installation. So far so good with the rest of the braces I've had for 10 months. I am shocked. I am very prone to canker sores. The Crest ProHealth mouth rinse really helps. I will be sure to step up my brushing & rinsing routine. If any of you didn't buy the Waterpik Ultra yet (Bed Bath & Beyond) you MUST get it. It improves the hygiene so much it is worth your investment of $60ish dollars. My sister is 37 and she just finished with braces and tipped me off to buy one of these right away. They are soooo good all the orthos should be promoting that product. When I come across a good product I can't shut up about it. If you need more details of model # and price let me know. I am going to go back now and buy the portable or travel version now that I have this Herbst thing to deal with. Things for cleanliness in the mouth just got 10 times harder.

Michelle

#11 Post by **scrabblemlhook** » Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:40 pm

so the ever lingering question is whether or not this Herbst device can give someone a new bite pattern with jaw relocation permanently? I have had the jaw issues for 20+ years and I find it hard to believe one year of wearing this will cure my jaw problems.... I asked the ortho and he said yes because of the teeth reorganization along with to create a whole new bite. I still am leary but moving forward.

#12 Post by **I love my teeth** » Tue Jul 21, 2009 8:06 pm

I really know nothing about this device, but I do have a severe (10+mm) overjet, and will be getting an OS consult for surgery to advance the mandible. Is there a reason that you guys know of that one would use this device to move the lower jaw forward, or the upper teeth backward in lieu of surgery?? Was surgery an option for you?? Just trying to gather some info before my Aug consult,
thanks in advance

Christine

#13 Post by **scrabblemlhook** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:17 am

Dear "I Love My Teeth",
I was referred by my regular dentist to this Orthodonist Specialty Place. Surgery never seemed to be an option because we never talked about it. I do know they do work with oral surgeons on referrals from the ortho. My top teeth overlapped my entire bottom teeth and more. I never brought up the subject of surgery either. Ortho has been working on moving my top teeth by tilting them out as my lower jaw has been essentially trapped since childhood. This is to make room for the forward movement he wants to accomplish with the Herbst device. He said it is small. We are talking mm's here were his exact words.

Michelle, still 39

#14 Post by **scrabblemlhook** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 5:33 am

well, it was less than 24 hours and I have confirmed there are 2 HUGE canker sores already in my mouth.

One is by the front arm where the screw is. The one that really sticks into my cheek. The ortho had been unknowingly pushing on my cheek while he was reinstalling that second side yesterday. I about went thru the roof. The technician asked if I wanted the screws installed to help smooth those posts until they install the rest of the device weeks from now. I was thinking why would anyone in their right mind say "no". So I said "yes" and wondered why they hadn't offered that the day before. Too late. The damage to cheek has been done. Huge canker sore there now.

The other is on the way back side of my tongue. It is from the piece of metal holding onto the last molar behind the crown. It was very sharp at the tip and they did not grind it off until I complained it was cutting up my tongue already while they were installing. So yeah that's a nice wonderful place to try to put the Apthasol prescription paste I already had for canker sores. This sore makes it feel like I have a sore throat when I swallow and it is not like I need another source of pain right now.

I am relieved to have this message board to help me make it thru this ordeal. Sparing the details from my family and friends.

I want to add...I hope to not be scaring someone away from getting help. I waited this long due to not having $ to pay for all this. I could have buckled down and worked out a way to pay earlier and now I wish I had. It would be better to have this all done the earliest you knew about it if you could figure out a way to pay without going bankrupt. For me the looming age 40 became the final factor, now or never! All in all, my dental insurance will pay $1000 total and I will pay $4,000+. It probably is standard practice most places to have a 2 year payment plan. So I sort of regret not buckling down with the finances and doing this sooner. I knew first that I needed this back when I was 17.

YouTube · #15 Post by **retainerjoe** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 6:27 am

i to have a herbst appliance , mine is for tmj an sleep apnea, it seems to be working ok , it does take a bit of getting use to , an after the rod adjustments on it you can get pretty stiff in the joints , but yes it does work , good luck , you can check out my link on the bottom of the page to see mine at work

Metal Mouth Message Board

Herbst device at 39 Anyone?

Herbst device at 39 Anyone?

I am 39 and have had the bottom half of Mr. Herbst installed

how can these things permanently help us 39 yr olds?

canker sores, age 39, with Herbst