The real deal with Damon?

[Leslie022]

Anna, try not to worry! Very few of us have had any problems with our Damons. No matter what bracket you choose, there is always a chance that a bracket might pop off or a wire break. I have absolutely NO problems! You should be fine as long as you have a competent orthodontist. I believe it was <b>ingyandbert</b> that said her orthodontist's office is a training center...
[quote=ingyandbert]Regarding the relative popularity of Damons, my ortho's office is also a Damon training center. They have orthos from all over the U.S. and many foreign countries come to train on the Damon system. At one of my appointments about a month ago, the ortho told me they had just had a group of orthos from Korea come in. Damons are definitely gaining in the marketplace.[/quote]
So, yes, your ortho <i>should</i> be trained. If not, report him!

Again, try not to let some of these "bad" stories scare you! I'm love my Damon's and find them to be incredibly comfortable. I wouldn't change brackets for anything...well maybe I would if someone offered me at least $50,000!

[Harpua]

Sorry that my post wasn't clear. I don't regard changing wires as a problem either. I'm on my third set of wires and it's been about 6 months. I don't have a good feel for whether this is "fast" or "slow", compared to other folks. And, there was a question about treatment speed somewhere in the initial post.

But, the opening/closing part has become a problem for me. I'm currently using Colgate Total toothpaste. What kind do you use?

And, when you said "It's the skill of the ortho, NOT THE BRACKET", were you referring to my opening/closing problem? If so, do you have any advice? I really don't want to switch orthos at this point.

SO glad that's clearer now. I don't want a newbie thinking that wire changes were a problem!! I've had 5 upper and 4 lower wire changes in 11 months.

I use Rembrandt Canker Sore or Sensitive toothpastes. Every time I suggest someone use one of these, I get this: . Hey, it's worth it if it helps, right? My ortho's assistant is always quite pleased at how easily my doors open and close.

No, I was referring to the original poster about the skill thing. Not your doors. I'm very sorry if that was vague. Thank you for being patient with me

I just think (please note that this post is directed at NO ONE in particular) that my ortho and Damon 3's are a perfect fit. Neither the Damons nor my ortho are for everyone. Like Maryaten said, the problems seem to be infrequent.

To each his own, what works for many may not work for some. I don't know if what I want to say is what a I am saying......

Just be aware that I am not judging, ridiculing, or cutting anyone down for their orthodontic choices. I just want posters to know that Damon's aren't bad. (again, not directed at any previous posters).

All this is rather new to me, all I've ever had was a removeable brace, i think you guys call it a retainer, when I was very young. It didn't help much in the long run.

So yeh, all this stuff about wire changes, and sores, and ulcers, and wires slipping round, headaches, pressure... erm, it's a little bit scary! I've been geting really psyched about finally getting my teeth sorted, but I guess it's good to know all that's involved, even if it is a little bit off nervewracking!

It is all quite nerve racking indeed, but once you get going, you will find likely find it a breeze when you consider all the fear you've worked up. Don't get hung up on a certain kind of bracket. If you would like to avoid extractions, get a few consults. There may be an ortho that is confident in approaching it without (regardless of bracket), but even still, in the end, extractions may be your best treatment. I understand trying to avoid it, but if it is the best option, it is the best option. Extractions are typically a walk in the park. I was majorly freaking out about mine, but I had 4 extractions done with only local anasthetic, took less than ten minutes and was pretty well recovered in about 2 days - virtually no pain. I had second bicuspids removed and no one could tell in the slightes that I was missing any teeth. Also, if its speed you want, extractions are gonna make for fast progress.

[JoeMama]

I would hate for this message to get lost: There IS some difference in the type of bracket used for some people. And of course, you should always ask your ortho for his/her advice, they're the experts. I would have needed extractions and surgery if I used regular brackets. Mine wasn't a hypothetical situation, it was the real deal. I'm not going to need that with the Damon system. At least that's what I'm told. The point is that you should ask your ortho, but sometimes different brackets can have advantages for different people. I'm not saying that Damons are better or worse, I'm just saying that you should ask you ortho which method would be best for your situation.

[Betty Bat]

Just to beat this subject a little farther into the ground ...

What should you look for if/when the ortho suggests Damons? How do you know that your ortho has the right training? Is there some required course for them to go through or is there some buzz word that should be mentioned? This sounds like a good thing for folks to check before they get their braces.

[JoeMama]

This is what I would ask, and a couple of these questions would be good regardless of what they're recommending:

• How often does the ortho use Damons and how long have they been using them? Are they happy with the results?
• Why are they recommending Damons (or other) for you? And why would they be better for you than other braces?
• Ask them about their training if you're curious.
• And if you're still not satisfied or confident, ask them if they have a reference. Most professionals are asked for work refereces on a regular basis. I'm not sure if orthos do this or not, but you can ask.

In the end, you're the client - you have the right to ask as many questions as you want. You're hiring them to do work for you. Ask ask ask!

[JoeMama]

Oh - and one more quick thing. Once you've asked your questions and made a decision regarding your ortho and treatment, you sort of need to trust them (in my opinion). You can always ask more questions, but constantly being in doubt your treatment doesn't seem like much fun.

[ingyandbert]

I had a consult with my current ortho several years ago, before they started using the Damon system. At that time, they told me I would need several extractions due to crowding. Later, I went back to them for another consult and they said because of the Damon technology, I would need NO extractions. In just two months in Damons, my teeth are much straighter and my arches are dramatically widened. I'm a believer!

[missingu]

My concern is the long-term. Will the great results last? I have searched for longitudinal studies on self-ligating/Damon versus conventional looking at at least 5 years out, but the studies aren't there. I'm sure they will come in time, and we will all hope that things stay looking good.

I guess I'm pretty conservative when it comes to new releases, at least in health care.

[jcdamon3]

Missingu:

He also posed an interesting question - if there are 10,000 orthodontists in the US and fewer than 7-8%, maybe even less, use them, is there a reason for that? The technology has been around since the late 1990s, too. Kind of interesting question.

Missingu:

My concern is the long-term. Will the great results last? I have searched for longitudinal studies on self-ligating/Damon versus conventional looking at at least 5 years out, but the studies aren't there. I'm sure they will come in time, and we will all hope that things stay looking good.

I guess I'm pretty conservative when it comes to new releases, at least in health care.

Hence the slow adoption---

Missingu: You haven't told us how you are getting along now that you have taken your damon's off. Are the new brackets much more comfortable? Do share!

[missingu]

Well, it's called a taste of freedom...

I'm not getting rebracketed until Ap 26th, because I need separators put in on Ap 17th. So now I get about 3 weeks of orthodontic freedom, then back in it again.

I really only dread one thing. That is if my mouth gets torn up again. It wasn't just irrirtated, there were chunks of tissue gone, and I can't go through that again.

I know ceramics are bulkier than metal, I just hope they rub and don't tear the tissue. Otherwise, I'm trying to enjoy all the "forbidden foods" between now and then - not that the waistline appreciates that but the taste buds do.

Thanks for asking.

[ingyandbert]

Why wouldn't the results last? It's just a matter of your ortho keeping the braces on long enough after the teeth straight to allow the bone to fill in and solidify around the tooth roots and then wearing a retainer or any follow up device recommended. No different than with conventional braces.

[jennielee81]

I agree! The brand of brackets shouldn't make a bit of difference once the teeth are moved and the braces are off. I would think that compliance by the patient wearing retainers is more important!

Thank you, missingu for the info. I read the Journal article and I could find nothing negative. Anything that was remotely negative was in a short section talking about the first Damon self-ligating in 1996 (Damon SL) followed by a description of how these problems were resolved. This article was written in 2003, Damon 3's hadn't been developed yet so this information is on Damon 2's. I pasted the concluding evidence at the bottom for anyone not interrested in the entire article. Anyone who is can click on the link below to save you the trouble of searching:

http://jorthod.maneyjournals.org/cgi/co ... type=HWCIT

Currently available self-ligating brackets offer the very valuable combination of extremely low friction and secure full bracket engagement and, at last, they deliver most of the potential advantages of this type of bracket. These developments offer the possibility of a significant reduction in average treatment times and also in anchorage requirements, particularly in cases requiring large tooth movements. Whilst further refinements are desirable and further studies essential, current brackets are able to deliver measurable benefit with good robustness and ease of use.

Anna, you can relax. Trust that your ortho knows what he/she is doing and you will be fine. Don't assume because one person had trouble with their Damons that you will also.

missingu, hope you're making the most of your freedom! I am a little jealous!!

[missingu]

Wait a sec, I am not the only one who has had problems with Damons, but maybe I am one of the few willing to talk about them (which may stop soon).

Kiwi said her ortho stopped using them so I am not alone, but we don't know what movitated the ortho to stop; Kiwi alluded to the ortho having "too many issues" with Damons but there's no way to know what that means without talking to the ortho specifically.

I am NOT going to detail what exactly I found negative in the article, because it seems like that just starts a maelstorm. I will, however, cite one section, under heading, Less chairside assistance and faster ligation/archwire removal:

"The original motive when developing the earlier self-ligating brackets was to speed process of ligation...Voudouris (citation) has also reported a fourfold reduction in archwire removal/ligation time with prototype Ineractwin bractets with lead to the commercially available In-Ovation brackets...A study by Hardwine (citation) found statistically significant, but clinically very modest savings in ligation/re-ligation time with Damon SL - an average of 24 seconds per archwire removal and replacement.

Remember, this is just my opinion, but overall I wanted to hear that there was clinical significance to the development of self-ligating systems, not that they allow orthos to get patients in and out faster. The article spent a while on the benefits of self-ligating brackets, but did not appear to give equal time to the benefits of conventional systems. It did mention them, but only the ligature systems and not brackets per se.

Again, this was what struck me - others are struck by other matters as is the case in reviewing any article. All I am doing is giving input, as do others.

[missingu]

Part 2 -

Regarding brackets and long-term effects. Damons are not just a bracket per se, it is a philosophy on how to use wires to move teeth using lighter and passive wires. I won't go down the path to describing it, as the info can be found in Ormco's ortho-based literature, but here is a summary:

"Rather than overpowering the biological system with high-force wires to drive teeth into position, we let the muscles, bone, tongue, and tissue determine where the teeth should be positioned."

This is a quote from Dr. Dwight Damon, quoting another ortho (Proffit, 1993), from Ormco's Ormco Connection publication, 2002, vol. 11, no. 1.

Thus my concern about movement and long-term stability. If the premise of the self-ligating and lightwire systems use different principles for ortho work than traditional, I am curious about long-term outcomes. Sounds good, but as I said, I like to be sure and I have found no literature talking about how the modified movement system works long-term.

[twinklehunkydory]

I think the fact is, people take a risk in getting any braces put on. I've known friends personally who had the traditional free braces on the nhs system, 2 teeth out, the usual, and their teeth are slipping back into their old ways, 5/6 years later.

It seems to me that I'm looking for the kind of brace/ortho combo which present the least problems, rather than the one with the most pludits, because everything has faults, and with new technology there are discoveries all the time.

A seperate question, are the damon 1s/2s/3s different only in their evolution? ie, damon 3s are just a bit more advanced than damon 2s, or do they actually work in different ways for different purposes?

Btw, I've noted a list of points/questions I'm going to raise at any consult I have, about not only damons but other braces too, based on people's experiences from this message board. So thanks for all the advice, I'm going to be able to give any ortho I meet a right good grilling about all this.