Metal Mouth Message Board

Hi guys. Sorry in advance for the long post, I guess this includes 'my story' + my mission to get straighter, whiter teeth!

I have had braces for about 3 months now (only on top set of teeth) and am interested in whitening my teeth. Here's a bit of background info. 22y/o male from UK. I never got offered braces from the NHS, probably because I didn't have severe crookedness. But by the time I was about 18 I wasn't happy with my smile, I didn't think my teeth were white or straight enough. After long deliberation I got clear braces at a private practice. I haven't had any cosmetic procedures done before. Unfortunately in my early years I didn't look after my teeth as well as I could have (unfortunately my parents were not proactive in this department and I was left largely to my own devices); though I did always brush daily, it was generally once rather than twice, and probably not thoroughly or with floss/mouthwash. When I hit 17/18 I starting looking after them more, I got an electric toothbrush (which was honestly a lifesaver) and started using mouthwash/flossing more regularly. But I think the damage had already been done. I've had 4/5 fillings and my teeth were quite stained.

I really started to take charge of my dental health when I got into my early 20s. I thought first things first best get braces, which I did. I made sure I didn't need any fillings or anything before I got them on, (though I think I will need more fillings in the future on my molars/premolars). But I didn't get any stain removal/whitening done beforehand (the orthodontist did a quick polish before putting the brace on) , because my initial plan was to get it straight after. Now I wish I had got some whitening done before (and obviously I will get some after no matter what). I'll be wearing my brace for well over a year and once my teeth start getting straighter (like the 6-8 month mark) I would like to start smiling, but I'm embarrassed by brace + yellowish teeth. I'm not sure why my teeth aren't that white. I think it is partly genetics (I think I have pretty weak teeth, none of my family had great teeth), partly lack of thorough care in early years as mentioned, and partly due to consuming a lot of tea + coffee + pasta sauces/curries in the past. Now I am very careful to avoid these staining foods, and never drink tea or coffee.

So my question is, if I've acquired these stains over the years due to these reasons, can they be reversed? Should I have gotten whitening before? And can I still get some whitening done now that will reduce these stains, and then after the braces come off I can get a stronger, more thorough whitening? That's what I'd like to do but I have no idea what is available. I saw my dentist very recently but I didn't ask, I've only just thought this through in the past couple of weeks. To complicate matters I have a chipped front tooth (small chip) from a fall when I was young, and I got that filled, but the filling was obviously to match my less-than-white teeth, and I don't think that will whiten up with treatment, so I might need that refilled or covered. Also, is the staining simply a sign of discolourment or might it be something more sinister like plaque buildup? I'm not really sure how staining works exactly! The longer you leave it, the more permanent it becomes? Also I haven't been to a hygienist though my dentist usually does a quick clean. I mentioned it but he said if I needed it I'd be recommended (so I presume I don't).

Right now I brush three times a day with a high-end Oral B electric toothbrush (Oral B Triumph), usually after meals though I usually wait a short while to avoid acid erosion. I use orthodontic heads on the surfaces that has the brace, and a regular for the rest. I also switch between regular/sensitive head to avoid overbrushing damage, and I switch between modes depending on what speed/type of cleaning I want (faster, slower, polishing, etc). I've been using Colgate Total 'Advanced Whitening' Toothpaste which I really like, in conjunction with Colgate 'Plax Whitening Mouthwash' (twice a day). So far I think my teeth do look a little whiter having used these! I guess a subquestion would be, should I be very careful not to overbrush, as I heard this can actually make teeth yellower? My toothbrush has a 2 minute timer but I tend to go over it, so I reckon I am brushing for about 8-9 minutes a day. To begin with I was using way too much toothpaste but now I am careful to use a smaller amount. But other than that, does this sound like the right thing to be doing, with the right products?

I'd love it if I could get some whitening/polishing done now so I feel comfortable with the colour of my teeth until I get the brace removed. I constantly see people with straight, white smiles and think 'omg how!' I was never really self-conscious about it until I got older. It's a shame that I didn't get to grips with it all at an early age, I guess some people might take the initiative but I didn't, and sadly my parents never paid any attention to it at all (if I have kids I won't make that mistake). Also the NHS tend to just do the absolute minimum and pay no attention to cosmetics. As a young person I never knew what to do about my teeth and didn't have the money either. But I still think I can achieve a nice smile eventually, I like the shape/size of my teeth and they're straightening up nicely with the brace, I just desperately want a nicer colour, and don't want to wait for it. Already I'm getting paranoid I will need veneers to get a nice white smile. With your advice (and I'll continue doing some reading/research) I'll probably make an appointment to see my NHS dentist and ask for some kind of whitening.

Thanks guys! Any help or advice is greatly appreciated!

You can't really get significant whitening done while in braces. The most effective whitening systems involve custom-fitted trays that hold bleaching gel against your teeth. Obviously braces would get in the way of that tray. (And you'd be left with non-white squares underneath when the braces come off.)

That said, you can start whitening as soon as the braces come off, and the process only takes a few weeks. (Or, if you go with the more expensive in-office procedure, a few hours.)

Most people do not need veneers; there are certain kinds of stains that do (amalgam, tetracycline, and fluorosis) but food stains bleach out quite easily.

My teeth stain easily and no amount of brushing will remove the stains. It's very frustrating. I get my teeth cleaned every 4 months now. The hygienist uses a special tool that sprays baking soda and water on my teeth to clean stains off of them. It's like a mini-sand blaster for teeth. My teeth are as white after one of these cleanings as they used to be after using professional whitening trays, and the nice thing is that no chemicals are required. If somehow there is a difference in the color of my teeth under the brackets after they come off, it can just be sand blasted away to even out the color.

Thank you for the replies! These two posts seem to be contradicting one another a bit! I understand that the braces can get in the way of the whitening tray, and obviously little squares are left behind (I figured that would be the case, but I thought you could even it out?) BaliGirl, you appear to be getting regular cleaning/stain removal whilst wearing braces? But this isn't an actual bleaching process as described by sirwired? Might this be something I want to look into in the meantime then?

I mean, I was originally planning on just waiting it out, and getting them whitened after. Does it make a difference? If I leave the stains longer is that a bad thing? Or is it actually better to minimize abrasive whitening processes? Will I still achieve good results whether it is now or in a year and a bit?

Thank you!

Hi there. I'm not going to get braced for another week but I know how you feel about the stain thing. I think in the UK it's not that common for people except celebs to whiten teeth. I've certainly never considered it in the past, but then why would I have wanted to draw attention to white but crooked teeth?
Now I'm 42 and having decided to take the plunge with braces, I certainly will look into whitening, but not until after my 18-24 month sentence in braces. I have longed to ask my lovely dentist for advice, but keep chickening out in case she says don't whiten them, it'll damage them, or something like that. Maybe I'll ask the ortho when I go for moulds this morning.
Sometimes I'm embarassed by the colour of my teeth, but then again (and probably in the natural light when most other people will see them) sometimes they don't look so bad.
I am prepared to reduce the red wine for the next couple of years. Not so sure about the coffee!

As far as celebs go I think the vast majority have veneers!

I'm almost 2 1/2 weeks from getting my braces, so I scheduled an appointment for professional zoom whitening next Wednesday. My ortho said it's better after but left the decision to me, but my primary dentist is crazy against it (got a temp crown last week and they bullied me and my ortho into postponing getting my top braces for 3 weeks, until after I get the perm crown even though I won't have any bands).

Anyways, their scaremongering is working because I am so tempted to cancel the whitening, but I hate the idea of going 18-20 months with yellowish teeth. I've read so much lately, and watched so many youtube videos, that I think my gaps will be significantly improved by the holidays, so I would like a nice looking smile, especially since I'm having top/bottom clear braces so it won't even be that obvious that I'm still wearing braces.

My primary dentist did say I can use Crest's 3D, but I didn't ask if they meant the strips or just the toothpaste. Regardless, I don't think either will compare to the results I can get from zoom, and my zoom treatment will be 13 days before my braces are put in, so I should be fine by then.

However, I've been reading these boards for hours tonight and somewhere someone mentioned they do something to the teeth to prep them for braces that make them more susceptible to staining. If that's true, it might be better for me to wait for zoom.

I guess I'll research Crest more, since it's cheaper and I planned to use their toothpaste and mouthwash anyway for the next 2 years to try to keep my teeth from staining, but I'll wait to Friday or Monday to cancel, if I do. (I haven't tried any of the Crest 3D products, yet.)

I whitened mine before getting my braces on and have been religiously using Colgate 3D White toothpaste and 3D White mouthwash with a baking soda/hydrogen peroxide brush once every couple of weeks. My teeth have stayed pretty white and my clear powerchains are only mildly discolored and still barely visible after four weeks. There's no reason to accept dingy.

I have often read on the forums that you shouldn't whiten teeth while wearing braces as upon removal you'll have dark rectangles where the brackets were placed. Seems to me to be the opposite. If your teeth were relatively white to begin with, then you'll have white rectangles remaining upon bracket removal as that area has been totally protected during the process.

Meanwhile, my hygienist and dentist were thrilled with the condition of my teeth when I went for my cleaning five months in.

I had heard that some whitening products can weaken the glue that holds your brackets to your teeth. I can't remember the source, so it may not be reliable, but maybe a good idea to double check with your ortho before whitening.

I've got a fair bit of staining on my teeth but I think I'm going to wait until everything is straight and I'm on my retainers before I get my teeth whitened.