Metal Mouth Message Board

Sorry for your experience. Can you give more details about the results of extraction and why it was a terrible decision?

I have had 4 extractions and braces, and it has worked for me. Sometimes it takes a while for it all to settle down.

I wish a successful conclusion to your extraction saga with your daughter.

So sorry

Sorry to hear of this, yes please if you can give further information on this?

I myself had 3 extractions before having my braces, 2 upper and 1 lower. (I had a lower tooth extraction a few months before these 3 and the reason why i had the 3rd one removed was to balance out this initial one). I have had my braces for a month now

how old are your daughters now, and how long do they have their braces on? if it is just for a short period, maybe you need patience to see the improvements in the future.

[quote="momonamission"]Her face has gotten progressively worse, since the braces have been off. Her face is now crooked, and has grown longer and narrower. She doesn't look healthy. Her smile is concave and very narrow. Did you read my post? I have had two reputable orthodontists already tell me that she will need jaw surgery to bring her jaw/jaws forward where they belong because they have been pushed back. There isn't an orthodontist anywhere near me with the skills to even begin to reverse what's been done. My life is a nightmare.[/quote]
I am sorry to hear that. wish the best for you and your daughters. actually, i am about to extract 5 teeth which including one wisdom teeth, then put braces. i am worried about that too. i have too dead upper lateral teeth and have to extract asap. i will recheck with my orthodontist tomorrow. my situation is a little than your daughters. i am 31, so i am not growing, second, my teeth is crowded.

[quote="momonamission"]Find an orthodontist who is willing to use arch expansion on you. At least to try it. There is also SARPE surgery. Hopefully they aren't planning on closing the spaces. It will cause facial deformity and health problems. Get expansion, diamond braces and implants. I am not an orthodontist but I have done extensive research on this topic. Good luck to you! Don't let them extract ANY healthy teeth! Get other opinions if you have two. You won't regret it.[/quote]

thank you so much for your great suggestions. i will talk to them tomorrow. but i really do not want do implant. it is not only very expense but also not real, hard to maintain, and easy to have infection. it is a tough situation. yeah, because my jaw is small, and my teeth are crowed. we do plan to close the gap by the braces.

momonamission wrote:Find an orthodontist who is willing to use arch expansion on you. At least to try it. There is also SARPE surgery. Hopefully they aren't planning on closing the spaces. It will cause facial deformity and health problems. Get expansion, diamond braces and implants. I am not an orthodontist but I have done extensive research on this topic. Good luck to you! Don't let them extract ANY healthy teeth! Get other opinions if you have two. You won't regret it.

Momonamission,

Not all extractions go poorly. When properly used, they are a very useful orthodontic tool. (My wife had extractions as a child and has a gorgeous smile.) Certainly the changes brought about by extractions are far more stable than jaw surgery (or non surgical expansion in adults), which is well known to be very susceptible to relapse post-treatment.

Sometimes the arch just plain isn't big enough, and that's all there is to it. Sometimes the appropriate treatment is expansion, sometimes extractions make more sense. In fact, I'd never choose an orthodontist that never extracted teeth because it meant that he/she isn't using all the tools available even when some of those tools (such as extractions) can achieve the best result under some circumstances.

In my wife's case, her arch was plenty wide enough, but it was too shallow to accommodate her teeth and she was very bucktoothed as a child prior to treatment. Arch expansion likely would have been both unattractive and unstable; extraction was the proper choice, and it worked very well.

As far as braces go: Contrary to their marketing, Damon braces aren't anything special and neither they, nor any other self-ligating bracket, can do a thing that conventional bracket cannot. This has been borne out in pretty much every study not sponsored by an orthodontic manufacturer. Certainly self-ligating brackets are smaller, and have some benefits to the orthodontist, but I personally wouldn't pay any attention to bracket brand (or type) when selecting an orthodontist and treatment plan.

The "Damon System" also includes a more squared-off archwire vs. the a conventional archwire, but other brands have similar archwires available. (The 3M MBT system comes to mind also.)

[quote="momonamission"]Are you a traditional orthodontist? After what I've seen happen to my daughter and the devastation it has caused in our lives, I would never try to encourage anyone to get extraction without seeing several functional orthodontists first. The same orthodontist that treated my daughter ended up treating my niece ( Apparently my I didn't discuss our issue with my sister). I found out a couple of months ago that he extracted four of her teeth. She was already insecure about a double chin that she had and now it is way worse because she lost the chin that she had. It is such a barbaric treatment especially with all the advances in treatment now. No one needs straight teeth that badly.[/quote]

i talked to my doctor today. he was professional and confident to my case, and the same time, i saw a patient there just took her braces off with teeth extraction. she looked much better than before, and she was very happy for her result. so i am going to do according to my old plan. Last night, i read a very good article about a patient's experience of braces with extraction. she did mention that it was not good choice for kids/non-adult to have extraction for braces. it is because their jaws still growing.
good luck to your daughter.

No, I'm not an orthodontist; I'm a regular schmuck with braces, just like most people here.

I'm just saying that sometimes extractions are indeed the best treatment plan. There isn't always a way to avoid them, and not doing extractions when they were necessary can lead to an unstable long-term result.

Certainly you don't want an orthodontist that extracts teeth from nearly every patient, but you also don't want one that never thinks they are necessary, because sometimes they clearly are.

When we are talking about extractions and the dangers, etc are we including wisdom teeth as well? Because I am very confident I need mine removed before putting braces and I am concerned now.

momonamission wrote:Like I said, I would encourage anyone who has been told they need extractions to get multiple opinions. You can't get those healthy teeth back once they're gone. I unfortunately trusted the first idiot that I went to, which turned into the biggest mistake of my life. I would give anything to turn the clock back. My heart is broken that I let this happen to my child.

I don't doubt that your child's extractions went badly, and my heart goes out to both of you, but what you said was: "Don't let them extract ANY healthy teeth!" Sometimes they just gotta go.

I agree that if an orthodontist suggests extractions you should absolutely get another opinion, but you should then go with the plan that makes sense, and in many cases, that will be the plan involving extractions. As a counterpoint, a co-worker had his daughter treated by a "never extract" ortho, and while they looked fine on de-bracing day, when the brackets came off her lower teeth splayed outwards because her lower arch is of insufficient length; extractions (probably lower pre-molars) would have been a better choice for her. They both know this now, but not after spending years and thousands on braces that will have to be repeated later (with extractions this time) if she ever wants a good smile.

An ortho that wants to avoid extractions when crowding is present needs a plan for dealing with the too-short arch. In the case of the upper arch, palatal expansion is a good option for many patients, especially if the arch depth is good. The lower arch has fewer options, as it does not expand as readily as the upper. If the ortho doesn't have a plan to deal with severe crowding other than to wrestle the teeth into place and hope for the best, then the treatment simply isn't going to work long-term.

With my Orthodontist, he explained to me 2 different options. He explained to me the surgical approach and the non-surgical approach (that included extractions). My case was a bit more difficult as i already had a tooth removed at least over a year before i finally took the plunge with braces, this limited me what choices i could go for. I do have to get an implant for one of my front teeth at the end of my journey which is another factor to deal with.

When i was around 21 years old this is when i initially decided to look into braces. At this time the Orthodontist i saw suggested a surgical approach along with brace. But this Orthodontist listed all the cons to me before the pros that came with this approach eg possible facial nerve damage, lengthy healing time, change in facial profile, no guarentee of final result etc. This scared me away (also the cost was way out of reach). The Ortho then suggested that once the surgery and braces were done, to compliment the changes i could look at plastic surgery for my nose and chin!!

Now going forward a few years im now dealing with an Orthodonist who im much more confident with. He agreed that while surgery may deliver a better result (though with a different approach than what i was previously advised) it is not the only path that can be taken.

With the tooth that was already removed plus 2 wisdom teeth taken out a few years back, he balanced out the remaining teeth by removing 3 others (without consulting quite a few xrays and moulds taken). He advised if i had retained a full compliment of teeth (this included wisdom teeth) the surgery would have been better suited. While i have liked to avoid the removal of any more teeth (who does!?!) i really had no choice. It was either extract and go for it or nothing. If i was pushed more for the surgical approach again would i have taken it? most likely not.

The one questions i did ask him: would the extractions/braces change the shape of my mouth/face/profile? He advised it would be very minimal if anything at all. Id like to add that i have a profound overbite along with an openbite.

With either approach - there are risks, we cannot predict the end result 100%. While they can get it very very close (it is their profession!) there is a small percentage of uncontrollable variable factors that they have to contend with. They can lay out a plan and follow that. How the teeth move is up to body and also is dependant on our care and cooperation.

Im not trying to suggest in any way my case is the same as yours, please do not take this as that. I just wanted to explain my story to you as i have gone down the extraction path myself. Each and every case is different and calls for a different approach. Im sorry to hear that extractions have caused your family grief, i hope that you find an Orthodontist you are most confortable with.

Pearlywhite wrote:Because I am very confident I need mine removed before putting braces and I am concerned now.

What are you concerned about? I'll remove all 4 of my wisdom teeth in a couple of weeks and I can hardly wait!

momonamission wrote:Are you a traditional orthodontist? After what I've seen happen to my daughter and the devastation it has caused in our lives, I would never try to encourage anyone to get extraction without seeing several functional orthodontists first. The same orthodontist that treated my daughter ended up treating my niece ( Apparently my I didn't discuss our issue with my sister). I found out a couple of months ago that he extracted four of her teeth. She was already insecure about a double chin that she had and now it is way worse because she lost the chin that she had. It is such a barbaric treatment especially with all the advances in treatment now. No one needs straight teeth that badly.

I am glad that you have posted your story here. It is always important to have several consolations, to be aware of all the options and have an orthodontist who is willing to discuss different treatment options with a parent or the patient. Parents/patients too should do some research before they jump into treatment - and not just dental treatment, any medical treatment.
However, saying that extractions are never necessary is not true. I had my upper palate expanded as a child but it was more difficult to do anything with my lower jaw. I had 1 mandibular premolar extracted when I was 13. As I am naturally missing an upper later incisor, the extraction balanced both my jaws and gave me an equal number of teeth. My orthodontist as a child was a functional orthodontist (one of the very few around at the time).
My present orthodontist is also a functional orthodontist but she occasionally does extractions. While it most certainly seems to have been a mistake for your daughter to have had extractions, this isn't always the case. An orthodontist has to use all the tools available to him/her and extracting teeth is just one of them (but one that should be used only when there are no other options and not as an "easy way out").
I truly am sorry for your daughter and for you. It sounds awful what happened to her and I can see how upset and angry (rightly so) you are over the whole situation. What are the options now for your daughter?

You said your daughter had extraction when she was 13. Around that age, people's face changes a lot. Why are you so confident that extractions caused the change?

I had extractions, and I have no regret at all. I never liked my profile because of my overjet. Now I do like look at my profile in the mirror. Also my smile looks prettier.