Metal Mouth Message Board

Hi, anyone out there have any experience with either at Kaiser Los Angeles?
Seems they are relatively new to Kaiser.
What do you guys think about Kaiser in general?
Any info is appreciated.

I would avoid Kaiser all together. Please see my website http://www.confessionsofametalmouth.com and read up on my Kaiser experience. I have helped council quite a few other Kaiser botched cases to 1.) get on a path to retreatment, and 2.) seek legal advice. I just met another California patient yesterday who was basically as screwed up as I was, and her case was for sure just as negligent through and through, especially in how they've handled her care once it was clear her results were right. Very sad. I'd avoid Kaiser at all costs. Now that I've had jaw surgery with kaiser and without kaiser, I can compare care, and I am 110% confident in saying that the care you're getting from kaiser is so substandard that it's not even funny. It's actually quite criminal. Get with a PPO and chose a surgeon you want. One that will invest the proper time and planning in to your case. One that truly cares about the patient, and not the big HMO and paycheck they work for. Kaiser is like a factory. You're just a number to them. The most minimal of time is spent on you and you will get little to no surgical planning, which is something absolutely necessary for this surgery. Trust me-- go outside of Kaiser.

Wow that's terrible. You'd think with so much experience these situations could be avoided.
I'm going to look around and see what the cost is for a top notch surgeon in my area. Thanks for the information.

eli27 wrote:Wow that's terrible. You'd think with so much experience these situations could be avoided.
I'm going to look around and see what the cost is for a top notch surgeon in my area. Thanks for the information.

There are some really great names in SoCal-- You've got Arnette, Gunson, Relle. If you want to make the journey up to the Bay Area for a consult, check out my revision surgeon, Nestor Karas in Walnut Creek.

[quote="LyraM45"][quote="eli27"]Wow that's terrible. You'd think with so much experience these situations could be avoided.
I'm going to look around and see what the cost is for a top notch surgeon in my area. Thanks for the information.[/quote]

There are some really great names in SoCal-- You've got Arnette, Gunson, Relle. If you want to make the journey up to the Bay Area for a consult, check out my revision surgeon, Nestor Karas in Walnut Creek.[/quote]

Yeah I'm familiar with those mentioned, and they probably charge a fortune. I might consult with them anyway. Thanks for the info.

By the way Lyra, since you've been through it, how difficult is the recovery from double jaw surgery?
I'm 35 now just getting started, and sometimes I second guess myself going through with it.

I was 30 for my first surgery, and despite it being wrong, my recovery went pretty well. Double jaw no genio. My revision was just this Feb and now 32. Revision recoveries are always much harder, and this one definitely was. So, depending on what you have done and how you react with anesthesia and how physiologically you handle things (like my first time and similar to all of my major injuries, I didn't swell bad, no major bruising, and I bounced back really quick. No anesthesia issues for me ever) will depend on your recovery. I've seen people have a REALLY rough go of it, and others bounce right back and say it's no big thing. What are you getting done?

[quote="LyraM45"]I was 30 for first surgery, and despite it being wrong, my recovery went pretty well. Double jaw no genio. My revision was just this Feb and now 32. Revision recoveries are always much harder, and this one definitely was. So, depending on what you have done and how you react with anesthesia and how physiologically you handle things (like my first time and similar to all of my major injuries, I didn't swell bad, no major bruising, and I bounced back really quick. No anesthesia issues for me ever) will depend on your recovery. I've seen people have a REALLY rough go of it, and others bounce right back and say it's no big thing. What are you getting done?[/quote]


So far these are the issues:
8mm over bite
Upper jaw is narrow, and instead of sarpe surgery, ortho is recommending a three piece split of my upper jaw to avoid two surgeries.
I'm going for braces in May, and hopefully get the surgery within 12 months, possibly 18.
I'm anxious yet a little scared. Lol

I live in SoCal, and I have Kaiser. I'm probably going to end up seeing a Kaiser surgeon in Los Angeles. I've been researching these two doctors as well, but I can't seem to find any reviews online. It would be helpful to learn what other patients' experiences have been with either of them.

[quote="Ravenclaw"]I live in SoCal, and I have Kaiser. I'm probably going to end up seeing a Kaiser surgeon in Los Angeles. I've been researching these two doctors as well, but I can't seem to find any reviews online. It would be helpful to learn what other patients' experiences have been with either of them.[/quote]

To you and eli27:

If Anaheim isn't too far for you, consider a consultation with Dr. David Bell of Kaiser in Orange County. Despite the concerning comments above regarding Kaiser's care, I can personally attest to his world class surgical planning, operation, and post-op evaluation. If you're going through Kaiser in Southern California, Dr. Bell is worth researching.

bighoss wrote:If Anaheim isn't too far for you, consider a consultation with Dr. David Bell of Kaiser in Orange County. Despite the concerning comments above regarding Kaiser's care, I can personally attest to his world class surgical planning, operation, and post-op evaluation. If you're going through Kaiser in Southern California, Dr. Bell is worth researching.

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll research Dr. Bell some more. I saw one negative review on HealthGrades, but I'll keep an open mind. What was the process like for you, bighoss? How was the planning phase like? How often did you have to meet with the surgeon before the surgery?

[quote="Ravenclaw"][quote="bighoss"]If Anaheim isn't too far for you, consider a consultation with Dr. David Bell of Kaiser in Orange County. Despite the concerning comments above regarding Kaiser's care, I can personally attest to his world class surgical planning, operation, and post-op evaluation. If you're going through Kaiser in Southern California, Dr. Bell is worth researching.[/quote]

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll research Dr. Bell some more. I saw one negative review on HealthGrades, but I'll keep an open mind. What was the process like for you, bighoss? How was the planning phase like? How often did you have to meet with the surgeon before the surgery?[/quote]

His greatest volume of reviews are found here: http://www.vitals.com/doctors/Dr_David_L_Bell/reviews

My process was as follows:
1. 60-90 minute consultation pre-orthodontics several years ago where he formally diagnosed and documented my case. Asks lots of questions and answers any of yours. Following this meeting, my orthodontist began communicating with Dr. Bell and I would not see him until my orthodontics were complete.

2. Fast forward a year. Dr. Bell has an approximate 6 month waitlist, therefore I met with him when my orthodontist felt I was nearing the end of my treatment so there is no down time. Bell did a thorough examination with x-rays, study models, etc. and determined I would likely be ready in 6 months time. Surgery scheduled.

3. Fast forward 6, 2, 1 weeks pre-op. He orders a CT scan so he can plan the surgery virtually with Kaiser staff. At this point he knows exactly what movements will be performed and this is the final opportunity to voice concern or ask for specific cosmetic preferences.

4. Surgery was 9 hours (I had tremendous movement and an overall severe case). 100% success and no complications within the OR.

5. He greets you 1 day post-op in intensive care unit to see how you're doing and show your family/friends how to clean your mouth.

6. Meet him once a week for the first 6 weeks, then once every 2 weeks, then once a month, and so on.

I hope this outline is easy to follow. Dr. Bell is meticulous and expects the same from his patients. I have no complaints so far! I don't mean for this to sound like a sales pitch though. Ultimately you must look around LA, OC, etc. and find the surgeon who satisfies your needs. Jaw surgery is very serious in nature so it is imperative that you do not settle for any surgeon less than spectacular.

bighoss wrote:I hope this outline is easy to follow. Dr. Bell is meticulous and expects the same from his patients. I have no complaints so far! I don't mean for this to sound like a sales pitch though. Ultimately you must look around LA, OC, etc. and find the surgeon who satisfies your needs. Jaw surgery is very serious in nature so it is imperative that you do not settle for any surgeon less than spectacular.

Thanks! The outline was very helpful. Even if I don't end up seeing Dr. Bell, I kind of have a better idea now of the process at Kaiser.

I'm a perfectionist, so I'm really trying to find the best doctor under my insurance plan. I'm leaning towards a couple of surgeons in LA, but I'm still looking at others in the area. Dr. Bell has a lot of great reviews on Vitals.com. The skeptical part of me says that some of those might be fake due to the sheer number of them compared to the number of reviews for other famous maxillofacial surgeons I searched. But they probably aren't all fake. I also found another positive mention of Dr. Bell in this forum, so I'll definitely consider him. Again, thanks for providing us with this info!

[quote="bighoss"][quote="Ravenclaw"][quote="bighoss"]If Anaheim isn't too far for you, consider a consultation with Dr. David Bell of Kaiser in Orange County. Despite the concerning comments above regarding Kaiser's care, I can personally attest to his world class surgical planning, operation, and post-op evaluation. If you're going through Kaiser in Southern California, Dr. Bell is worth researching.[/quote]

Thanks for the suggestion! I'll research Dr. Bell some more. I saw one negative review on HealthGrades, but I'll keep an open mind. What was the process like for you, bighoss? How was the planning phase like? How often did you have to meet with the surgeon before the surgery?[/quote]

His greatest volume of reviews are found here: http://www.vitals.com/doctors/Dr_David_L_Bell/reviews

My process was as follows:
1. 60-90 minute consultation pre-orthodontics several years ago where he formally diagnosed and documented my case. Asks lots of questions and answers any of yours. Following this meeting, my orthodontist began communicating with Dr. Bell and I would not see him until my orthodontics were complete.

2. Fast forward a year. Dr. Bell has an approximate 6 month waitlist, therefore I met with him when my orthodontist felt I was nearing the end of my treatment so there is no down time. Bell did a thorough examination with x-rays, study models, etc. and determined I would likely be ready in 6 months time. Surgery scheduled.

3. Fast forward 6, 2, 1 weeks pre-op. He orders a CT scan so he can plan the surgery virtually with Kaiser staff. At this point he knows exactly what movements will be performed and this is the final opportunity to voice concern or ask for specific cosmetic preferences.

4. Surgery was 9 hours (I had tremendous movement and an overall severe case). 100% success and no complications within the OR.

5. He greets you 1 day post-op in intensive care unit to see how you're doing and show your family/friends how to clean your mouth.

6. Meet him once a week for the first 6 weeks, then once every 2 weeks, then once a month, and so on.

I hope this outline is easy to follow. Dr. Bell is meticulous and expects the same from his patients. I have no complaints so far! I don't mean for this to sound like a sales pitch though. Ultimately you must look around LA, OC, etc. and find the surgeon who satisfies your needs. Jaw surgery is very serious in nature so it is imperative that you do not settle for any surgeon less than spectacular.[/quote]




Hello,

This is so refreshing to hear. I researched for days to find a good surgeon within Kaiser, and I found the best reviews with Dr, David Bell at Anaheim Kaiser. I had my first consultation with Dr. Bell back in December i believe. He thought i would have to have double jaw surgery just by looking at me. He referred me to an awesome ortho in corona that he works with quite often. After i got my molds done, i took them to Dr. Bell and he determined that i would have to get SARPE surgery first, then braces, then wisdom teeth extracted, and then jaw surgery. He is very detailed, and he seems a little rough around the edges but he just wants things done right. A couple days after i got the plan, i was able to schedule my SARPE surgery for April 6th 2017! He says that i have very pretty features and that he expects the best outcome.

[quote="gennevie77"]
Hello,

This is so refreshing to hear. I researched for days to find a good surgeon within Kaiser, and I found the best reviews with Dr, David Bell at Anaheim Kaiser. I had my first consultation with Dr. Bell back in December i believe. He thought i would have to have double jaw surgery just by looking at me. He referred me to an awesome ortho in corona that he works with quite often. After i got my molds done, i took them to Dr. Bell and he determined that i would have to get SARPE surgery first, then braces, then wisdom teeth extracted, and then jaw surgery. He is very detailed, and he seems a little rough around the edges but he just wants things done right. A couple days after i got the plan, i was able to schedule my SARPE surgery for April 6th 2017! He says that i have very pretty features and that he expects the best outcome.[/quote]

I'm glad my post helped. Good luck with the process, it will be challenging! Dr. Bell will make it a lot easier though.