Hello there! I've had my braces on for nearly a year, and I'm coming into the home stretch (yay!). My question is - since I am a thumbsucker, how will this affect my teeth once the braces are removed?
Now, before you respond, let me say this: no dentist has ever asked me if I sucked my thumb and neither did my ortho when I went in for the treatment. It was never obvious in my teeth that I did, and the reason I got braces was not b/c of buck teeth or overbite. Since my teeth will be still be a bit vulnerable to movememnt once the braces come off, how should I appreach this to my ortho? For reasons you can imagine, I'm a bit secretive that I still suck my thumb (I am 25). I also don't plan on stopping.
I appreciate your help!
Question from a thumbsucker with braces
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jenns91civic
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I sucked my thumb until I was 11. I quit because my older brother and 3 older step brothers teased me and threatened to tell everyone at school (4 of us went to the same school).
I sucked my left thumb (I'm R handed) and I have overjet on the left only. Imagine that.
My cousin is 6 yo and sucks his thumb. His teeth have a seriously cool malocclusion from him sucking his thumb. They go in a nice arch then balloon out where his thumb goes. The poor guy is in for a rough haul in braces if his mother cares enough to notice (longggggg story why I worded it that way--I won't go into it lol).
You should stop because your teeth will move from the pressure and all the time in braces will be rendered pointless.
I sucked my left thumb (I'm R handed) and I have overjet on the left only. Imagine that.
My cousin is 6 yo and sucks his thumb. His teeth have a seriously cool malocclusion from him sucking his thumb. They go in a nice arch then balloon out where his thumb goes. The poor guy is in for a rough haul in braces if his mother cares enough to notice (longggggg story why I worded it that way--I won't go into it lol).
You should stop because your teeth will move from the pressure and all the time in braces will be rendered pointless.
Paramedic student
Full Braces (all metal) 5/12/1999 - 4/20/2005
Class II (overjet) on the left only
Upper and Lower Hawleys
Full Braces (all metal) 5/12/1999 - 4/20/2005
Class II (overjet) on the left only
Upper and Lower Hawleys
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Aleanne1980
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jenns91civic
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- Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 7:50 pm
They probably don't have a reason to suspect it because a lot of people were thumb suckers as kids and they may just assume you did it then. Maybe your teeth would have been in different positions if you didn't suck your thumb--the world will never know.
Paramedic student
Full Braces (all metal) 5/12/1999 - 4/20/2005
Class II (overjet) on the left only
Upper and Lower Hawleys
Full Braces (all metal) 5/12/1999 - 4/20/2005
Class II (overjet) on the left only
Upper and Lower Hawleys
I sucked my thunb till i was 29, im now 31. but i think i still suck my thumb in my sleep - i didnt know i sucked my thumb in my sleep till i fell alseep drunk on my mates sofa and he filmed me sucking my thumb (git) - im consdering wearing a glove on my hand when i sleep as im sure it will affect the speed of treatment.
The first question orthodontists are taught to ask thumb-suckers before treatment is " do you want to quit?" . If they say no - I do not treat. Granted this is usually posed to a 7 year old child.
Just please tell your doc about this. I have treated patients who have held out on me that they sucked their thumb and let me believe that I was just a moron orthodontist who could not move teeth. Kind of like a smoker not telling their cardiologist that they smoke a pack a day while he is wondering why their cardiac funtion is not responding to drugs.
By they way, jenns91civic, I love the term "seriously cool malocclusion"!!! I may use that on my next consultation for a kid with J.U.T. - jacked up teeth.
Just please tell your doc about this. I have treated patients who have held out on me that they sucked their thumb and let me believe that I was just a moron orthodontist who could not move teeth. Kind of like a smoker not telling their cardiologist that they smoke a pack a day while he is wondering why their cardiac funtion is not responding to drugs.
By they way, jenns91civic, I love the term "seriously cool malocclusion"!!! I may use that on my next consultation for a kid with J.U.T. - jacked up teeth.
Dr.J - Ortho
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HarveyLMiller
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:53 am
Re: Question from a thumbsucker with braces
Hi Aleanne,
I'm dissappointed at the preponderant replies here to your inquiry. First off, there are an incredible number of adult thumb suckers (tsers) in the world, to whit: www.thumbsuckingadults.com . Most of them do not suffer from maloclussions due to their habit, as you have already discovered with yourself. This is one of the reasons that they've been able to retain their habit into adulthood, because their occlusion didn't short circuit their tsing as it would have if they needed to obtain orthodontia due to tsing. Nor was there any other effective need or outside influence there to cause habit cessation.
The fact is, thumbsucking, when not resulting in negative health consequences, is a good habit, not a bad one. It is free, effective in enabling meditation-like calmness (there have been studies proving this), legal, very available, helps one to fall asleep under a variety of situations, helps one to concentrate, etc., etc. It isn't socially acceptable because it's associated, incorrectly, with being immature. Makes one wonder why other "adult" habits, like smoking, gambling, overeating, etc., most of which are definately bad, are more tolerated by the, typically, nonthinking public.
As to the answer. It's doubtful that your tsing will cause a problem, since it hadn't previously, including while you had your braces on. But, to be on the safe side, use your retainer. Are you comfortable tsing with your retainer? If not, that could be a problem since it means that you will have lots of time with your retainer off (assuming that you indulge through the night). It's obvious, though, that I believe your tsing to be a useful thing and understand and accept your wish not to stop. If tsing with your retainer is problematic, and it very well may not be, perhaps your dentist can design a retainer that is more comfortable for you in that respect.
Sincerely yours, a fellow thumbsucker,
Harvey
I'm dissappointed at the preponderant replies here to your inquiry. First off, there are an incredible number of adult thumb suckers (tsers) in the world, to whit: www.thumbsuckingadults.com . Most of them do not suffer from maloclussions due to their habit, as you have already discovered with yourself. This is one of the reasons that they've been able to retain their habit into adulthood, because their occlusion didn't short circuit their tsing as it would have if they needed to obtain orthodontia due to tsing. Nor was there any other effective need or outside influence there to cause habit cessation.
The fact is, thumbsucking, when not resulting in negative health consequences, is a good habit, not a bad one. It is free, effective in enabling meditation-like calmness (there have been studies proving this), legal, very available, helps one to fall asleep under a variety of situations, helps one to concentrate, etc., etc. It isn't socially acceptable because it's associated, incorrectly, with being immature. Makes one wonder why other "adult" habits, like smoking, gambling, overeating, etc., most of which are definately bad, are more tolerated by the, typically, nonthinking public.
As to the answer. It's doubtful that your tsing will cause a problem, since it hadn't previously, including while you had your braces on. But, to be on the safe side, use your retainer. Are you comfortable tsing with your retainer? If not, that could be a problem since it means that you will have lots of time with your retainer off (assuming that you indulge through the night). It's obvious, though, that I believe your tsing to be a useful thing and understand and accept your wish not to stop. If tsing with your retainer is problematic, and it very well may not be, perhaps your dentist can design a retainer that is more comfortable for you in that respect.
Sincerely yours, a fellow thumbsucker,
Harvey
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jennandtonic
- Posts: 551
- Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:06 pm
Maybe I'm just opening a can of worms here, but the above poster is a thumbsucker himself, therefore biased.
Several kids I know now, including my younger sister, are going to have to have braces as a direct result of their thumbsucking. It's a habit that results in movement of teeth in many cases. To say it's a 'good' habit is to say it's good as compared to a lot of other habits kids and adults can have, but it's not 'great,' and CAN impede the progress one has if they are trying to straighten their teeth.
I sucked my finger until I was about 8, stopped, and when I went to the orthodonist this year (I'm now 20), she asked 'at any time did you have a habit of sucking a finger?' and she could tell by the way two of my teeth were angled.
I'm not an expert, of course, and I wouldn't say stop sucking your thumb, but I would definitely tell your orthodonist.
Several kids I know now, including my younger sister, are going to have to have braces as a direct result of their thumbsucking. It's a habit that results in movement of teeth in many cases. To say it's a 'good' habit is to say it's good as compared to a lot of other habits kids and adults can have, but it's not 'great,' and CAN impede the progress one has if they are trying to straighten their teeth.
I sucked my finger until I was about 8, stopped, and when I went to the orthodonist this year (I'm now 20), she asked 'at any time did you have a habit of sucking a finger?' and she could tell by the way two of my teeth were angled.
I'm not an expert, of course, and I wouldn't say stop sucking your thumb, but I would definitely tell your orthodonist.
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HarveyLMiller
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Hi jennandtonic (nice...who's tonic (jus' kiddin'!)),
Yes, I'm biased but that doesn't negate the truth of what I wrote.
Recall, I indicated that, "The fact is, thumbsucking, when not resulting in negative health consequences, is a good habit, not a bad one." When I stated negative health consequences I meant the kind of maloclussions that either objectively result in health problems, like infections and gum disease or subjectively do, as in psychological handicaps directly attributable to the maloclussion, etc. So, in the case where that isn't true I proposed that by anyone's sensible criteria, there isn't any problem.
With the exception of ill conceived notions about immaturity which results in social stigmatization, thumb sucking is a good habit for its benefit/cost ratio, a way of looking at most things when determining if they are deleterious or not.
And, yes, it's true that digit sucking can move teeth. Where that's an issue braces may help but this doesn't affect most thumb and finger suckers, especially the great majority of those that take this habit into adulthood for both the reasons I hinted at in my previous post as well as many other reasons.
The point is this. Instead of automatically reflexing when the subject of thumb/finger sucking comes up, perhaps it's closer to the truth to consider the local situation while keeping an open mind. This principal works in the majority of any issues one may be privy to. I just noticed that it wasn't operating very well here, in most of the previous posts.
Harvey
Yes, I'm biased but that doesn't negate the truth of what I wrote.
Recall, I indicated that, "The fact is, thumbsucking, when not resulting in negative health consequences, is a good habit, not a bad one." When I stated negative health consequences I meant the kind of maloclussions that either objectively result in health problems, like infections and gum disease or subjectively do, as in psychological handicaps directly attributable to the maloclussion, etc. So, in the case where that isn't true I proposed that by anyone's sensible criteria, there isn't any problem.
With the exception of ill conceived notions about immaturity which results in social stigmatization, thumb sucking is a good habit for its benefit/cost ratio, a way of looking at most things when determining if they are deleterious or not.
And, yes, it's true that digit sucking can move teeth. Where that's an issue braces may help but this doesn't affect most thumb and finger suckers, especially the great majority of those that take this habit into adulthood for both the reasons I hinted at in my previous post as well as many other reasons.
The point is this. Instead of automatically reflexing when the subject of thumb/finger sucking comes up, perhaps it's closer to the truth to consider the local situation while keeping an open mind. This principal works in the majority of any issues one may be privy to. I just noticed that it wasn't operating very well here, in most of the previous posts.
Harvey
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jennandtonic
- Posts: 551
- Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2006 1:06 pm
I got from your last paragraph in your previous post that you don't think it will cause a problem, but you don't know this situation, and neither do any of the posters here. And who knows, maybe her previous thumbsucking affected her teeth, this is why she needs to fully disclose this to her orthodonist.HarveyLMiller wrote:Hi jennandtonic (nice...who's tonic (jus' kiddin'!)),
Yes, I'm biased but that doesn't negate the truth of what I wrote.
Recall, I indicated that, "The fact is, thumbsucking, when not resulting in negative health consequences, is a good habit, not a bad one." When I stated negative health consequences I meant the kind of maloclussions that either objectively result in health problems, like infections and gum disease or subjectively do, as in psychological handicaps directly attributable to the maloclussion, etc. So, in the case where that isn't true I proposed that by anyone's sensible criteria, there isn't any problem.
With the exception of ill conceived notions about immaturity which results in social stigmatization, thumb sucking is a good habit for its benefit/cost ratio, a way of looking at most things when determining if they are deleterious or not.
And, yes, it's true that digit sucking can move teeth. Where that's an issue braces may help but this doesn't affect most thumb and finger suckers, especially the great majority of those that take this habit into adulthood for both the reasons I hinted at in my previous post as well as many other reasons.
The point is this. Instead of automatically reflexing when the subject of thumb/finger sucking comes up, perhaps it's closer to the truth to consider the local situation while keeping an open mind. This principal works in the majority of any issues one may be privy to. I just noticed that it wasn't operating very well here, in most of the previous posts.
Harvey
Her orthodonist is the person to discuss her issues with in this situation. No one on here should either encourage or discourage her thumbsucking because they don't know her history.
BUT, she did ask this in the 'Ask the Doc' forum and she got the doc's opinion--to tell her orthodonist.
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HarveyLMiller
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- Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:53 am
Hi Meryaten,
Sorry if I appear defensive, I thought I was merely presenting another way of looking at the issue.
I agree that, whatever the affect, it should be discussed with her orthodontist. Still, orthodontists deal with biased samples, meaning, mostly the negative affects of digit sucking. It stands to reason that, if a thumb sucker's habit doesn't affect their occlusion they won't go to an orthodontist and the doctor will not generally know, by experience, that there are many thumb suckers who have acceptable occlusion. This means that, chances are, her orthodontist will give advice from the party line. The website I linked to in my initial remark has been instrumental in educating the public at large, and the profession in particular, about this other bit of knowledge.
I don't see where I reacted automatically. Fact is, the original poster asked for advice, clearly stating her intention to continue her gentle habit, yet people, instead of dealing within that reality, gave advice that ignored the parameters that were given so clearly. Because this is true, my reaction was appropriate since the issue wasn't about stopping her thumb sucking, it was how to deal with the aftereffects of successful orthodontia when one continues sucking their thumb. I think this is an interesting issue that, due to my thumb sucking bias (further due to the fact that I'm quite aware that the habit may not affect dentition while it retains all its other benefits), affects enough people to be worthy of serious consideration.
So, it's not automatic that, if one continues to suck their thumb after orthodontia, that their teeth will absolutely return to some previous level of maloclussion. This fact has been cataloged, at that previous site, by over 3000 filled surveys. There are methods that can be used to prevent that possibility without resorting to habit cessation. This is something that the original poster wanted to know, and something that is worth answering on its own merits, exclusive of cessation advise, because for many, cessation is not an option.
These methods can be anything from the way the thumb is placed, to the frequency and strength of sucking, to the customized design of retainers, and possibly other answers.
And, please, don't misunderstand me. Thumb sucking does cause maloclussions, no doubt. Thumb sucking can result in rare forms of infection, absolutely. I'm merely referring to the great numbers of cases where none of these factors operate, among the stealthy, mature adults of all walks of life who, secretly, continue to suck their thumbs, without negative affect, because of the positive benefits they've gotten from a habit that doesn't interfer with the rights and space of anyone else, unlike many other more "adult" habits.
Harvey
Sorry if I appear defensive, I thought I was merely presenting another way of looking at the issue.
I agree that, whatever the affect, it should be discussed with her orthodontist. Still, orthodontists deal with biased samples, meaning, mostly the negative affects of digit sucking. It stands to reason that, if a thumb sucker's habit doesn't affect their occlusion they won't go to an orthodontist and the doctor will not generally know, by experience, that there are many thumb suckers who have acceptable occlusion. This means that, chances are, her orthodontist will give advice from the party line. The website I linked to in my initial remark has been instrumental in educating the public at large, and the profession in particular, about this other bit of knowledge.
I don't see where I reacted automatically. Fact is, the original poster asked for advice, clearly stating her intention to continue her gentle habit, yet people, instead of dealing within that reality, gave advice that ignored the parameters that were given so clearly. Because this is true, my reaction was appropriate since the issue wasn't about stopping her thumb sucking, it was how to deal with the aftereffects of successful orthodontia when one continues sucking their thumb. I think this is an interesting issue that, due to my thumb sucking bias (further due to the fact that I'm quite aware that the habit may not affect dentition while it retains all its other benefits), affects enough people to be worthy of serious consideration.
So, it's not automatic that, if one continues to suck their thumb after orthodontia, that their teeth will absolutely return to some previous level of maloclussion. This fact has been cataloged, at that previous site, by over 3000 filled surveys. There are methods that can be used to prevent that possibility without resorting to habit cessation. This is something that the original poster wanted to know, and something that is worth answering on its own merits, exclusive of cessation advise, because for many, cessation is not an option.
These methods can be anything from the way the thumb is placed, to the frequency and strength of sucking, to the customized design of retainers, and possibly other answers.
And, please, don't misunderstand me. Thumb sucking does cause maloclussions, no doubt. Thumb sucking can result in rare forms of infection, absolutely. I'm merely referring to the great numbers of cases where none of these factors operate, among the stealthy, mature adults of all walks of life who, secretly, continue to suck their thumbs, without negative affect, because of the positive benefits they've gotten from a habit that doesn't interfer with the rights and space of anyone else, unlike many other more "adult" habits.
Harvey
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HarveyLMiller
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- Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 6:53 am
Hi Meryaten,
Your point is well taken and makes sense. Soon after orthodontia, the teeth are very susceptible to movement, due mostly because the underlying bone foundation has not had the time to solidify its newly formed position. In younger, growing, patients this fact is prolonged due to the growth remaining regardless of brace use or not. I would have to think, that though (in answer to your question) there is no study, to my knowledge, of the affects of thumb sucking after orthodontia, if a patient sucks their thumb without the proper use of the retainer the odds of a reversion to maloclussion are very high. The retainer is the key I feel. Well, there's one study idea, eh?!
As to how I came upon this post. I was researching orthodontia, via Google, as related to my own, personal, goals and this site impressed me as relatively unique in that there's a wide range of topics discussed, in laymen terms but with professional input, with ease of navigation, very user friendly, no subscription fee, etc. and after meandering through many subjects, I saw the search engine and plugged in "thumb", since it's of interest to me and I wondered how it was handled, if it was handled at all, here. Not much going on, but this thread was the most relavent and so, "POP", heah ah was!
Harvey
Your point is well taken and makes sense. Soon after orthodontia, the teeth are very susceptible to movement, due mostly because the underlying bone foundation has not had the time to solidify its newly formed position. In younger, growing, patients this fact is prolonged due to the growth remaining regardless of brace use or not. I would have to think, that though (in answer to your question) there is no study, to my knowledge, of the affects of thumb sucking after orthodontia, if a patient sucks their thumb without the proper use of the retainer the odds of a reversion to maloclussion are very high. The retainer is the key I feel. Well, there's one study idea, eh?!
As to how I came upon this post. I was researching orthodontia, via Google, as related to my own, personal, goals and this site impressed me as relatively unique in that there's a wide range of topics discussed, in laymen terms but with professional input, with ease of navigation, very user friendly, no subscription fee, etc. and after meandering through many subjects, I saw the search engine and plugged in "thumb", since it's of interest to me and I wondered how it was handled, if it was handled at all, here. Not much going on, but this thread was the most relavent and so, "POP", heah ah was!
Harvey