Hello, Lo!
I just got home from my first day back at work--meetings all day. We have a "welcome back to school" hour for the parents tonight, so I'm going to go and meet them. It was interesting to spend a morning with my new staff--every group is different and interesting in their own way! The kids arrive on Wednesday, and that will be VERY interesting.
Thank you for encouraging me. I am trying not to be afraid, or dwell too much on my condition, because if I do it upsets me. I really don't feel too bad, and aside from not being able to bite down or chew, I really don't have any problems to speak of. I'm so used to blended diet now, that I don't consider it an inconvenience. It sometimes feels kind of strange when I talk, like things are a little wobbly if my teeth happen to occlude. I also sometimes get some strange sensations when I swallow, from pressure on the roof of my mouth. But really, I'm managing OK.
Appointments next week! OD on Tuesday afternoon (what he's going to do is still a mystery to me!), and OS Wednesday morning first thing. It's going to be a lot of driving for me for a couple of days, since the offices are one one side of town, and my school is on the other. I'll work it all out, I'm sure!
Thanks again for all of your support. I'll keep everyone posted!
Stability Questions, LeFort I--Life with a delayed Union
Moderator: bbsadmin
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SandraJones
- Posts: 333
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:23 am
- Location: Chicago
hey Phil, I am still obsessing over this book you posted the link to !! It's absolutely fascinating. I'm reading the chapters out of order, the last I finished was the chapter about complications. It reminded me of something the physician had noted in the operational procedure ... at the downfracture time, my maxilla broke in the third molar sites instead of along the intended line. He wrote "This was no problem". ACK !! I'm imaging shattered frayed bone. And yet 26 years later I think I have had zero problems, and in my recent dental and orthodontic x-rays everything looks fine even to the critical eyes of the professionals, so it must have fractured cleanly, albeit in the wrong spots. The book said that unanticipated maxilla fractures have not been well documented, I'm guessing they are not as serious as unanticipated mandible fractures. Anyway, this is just one of many fascinating things that I am reading and I thank you again for posting that link !
I hope as each day passes you're better able to process your situation, as serious as it it. It makes me wonder how a person who is diagnosed with a very serious illness handles the news, I'm sure there's some well-documented process which starts out with shock and transforms into fear, and then hopefully a feeling of control as you research and consult with docs and take action to deal with the problem.
I hope as each day passes you're better able to process your situation, as serious as it it. It makes me wonder how a person who is diagnosed with a very serious illness handles the news, I'm sure there's some well-documented process which starts out with shock and transforms into fear, and then hopefully a feeling of control as you research and consult with docs and take action to deal with the problem.
Nov 1960: born
1973 ?: palate expander
1973-1977: braces
Aug 1981: Le Fort I, posterior impaction to correct anterior open bite and class II malocclusion
Aug 2007: braces again to correct various alignment issues and class II malocclusion
1973 ?: palate expander
1973-1977: braces
Aug 1981: Le Fort I, posterior impaction to correct anterior open bite and class II malocclusion
Aug 2007: braces again to correct various alignment issues and class II malocclusion
SandraJones,
"Peterson's Principles" is a great resource. I'm glad you're reading it and learning a lot.
At the risk of jinxing myself, I dare say that things have felt a little firmer over the last couple of days (KNOCK ON WOOD!). We'll just hope that something good is going on inside my body. I will see the surgeon again next week, and we'll see what HE has to say!
"Peterson's Principles" is a great resource. I'm glad you're reading it and learning a lot.
At the risk of jinxing myself, I dare say that things have felt a little firmer over the last couple of days (KNOCK ON WOOD!). We'll just hope that something good is going on inside my body. I will see the surgeon again next week, and we'll see what HE has to say!
Teeth feel like they are moving
Hey everyone,
I know this has probably been posted 1000x's , but I need to ask a few questions and hopefully get some solid answers back.
I am 16 days post op from SARPE surgery. My oral surgeon says I'm healing perfectly and my bite looks good. I am not turning anymore and have about a 4-5 mm space. Not in pain at all, which has been a great thing.
From reading other posts I would say I'm healing pretty good. I am able to eat things like pasta. I have to chew on my side, but its do able.
However I do have a problem. At random times, either by drinking or eating (usually eating), I get these sharp pulling feelings in my front teeth. They aren't painful, but they get my attention qucikly and it makes me not want to eat. It almost feels like my palate expander is moving, but I know its not b/c its cemented in there solid.
Does anyone know what exactly what this is? Its really annoying, and I know perhaps I may be pushing it when it comes to eating, but I can't live on soup, milkshakes, and ice cream forever ( its can happen sometimes when I eat these foods too).
My ortho told me that my space should close in a week or two, that is close to the point where no one would know that I had surgery. My speech has be dramatically affected, and I'm a high school teacher.
I know this post is really long, but if someone knows what this feeling is / and if its normal pleeeeeease let me know!
-Tom
I know this has probably been posted 1000x's , but I need to ask a few questions and hopefully get some solid answers back.
I am 16 days post op from SARPE surgery. My oral surgeon says I'm healing perfectly and my bite looks good. I am not turning anymore and have about a 4-5 mm space. Not in pain at all, which has been a great thing.
From reading other posts I would say I'm healing pretty good. I am able to eat things like pasta. I have to chew on my side, but its do able.
However I do have a problem. At random times, either by drinking or eating (usually eating), I get these sharp pulling feelings in my front teeth. They aren't painful, but they get my attention qucikly and it makes me not want to eat. It almost feels like my palate expander is moving, but I know its not b/c its cemented in there solid.
Does anyone know what exactly what this is? Its really annoying, and I know perhaps I may be pushing it when it comes to eating, but I can't live on soup, milkshakes, and ice cream forever ( its can happen sometimes when I eat these foods too).
My ortho told me that my space should close in a week or two, that is close to the point where no one would know that I had surgery. My speech has be dramatically affected, and I'm a high school teacher.
I know this post is really long, but if someone knows what this feeling is / and if its normal pleeeeeease let me know!
-Tom
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Brandyleigh35
- Posts: 1018
- Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2006 4:25 pm
- Location: Alaska
- Contact:
Hey Tom,
I can't address the pulling feelings specifically, however I do know that when I had my SARPE my front teeth were really tender for quite awhile. At 16 days post op its hard to say, it could just be part of the healing process in that maybe your maxilla is trying to settle into its new position and that cold and hot things cause the muscles to contract which could account for that pulling feeling. It could also be due to your sinuses trying to re-group and heal up. For a long time I could feel a shooting sensation from like right below my left sinus all the way along my top left teeth. It eventually went away as I continued to heal. It took a full 15 months for things to get back to totally normal again, with feeling in my front left incisor being the very last to recover.
You really do want to go kindof easy on the eating thing though. Granted I realize it's hard to eat just smoothies and shakes, but you want to keep it soft for a few weeks. My ortho said it takes 3 months for the bones to fully heal, and while I was eating soft chicken the day of my SARPE, I was careful to keep things soft, like pasta, for a good month afterwards. The sensation you are feeling could also be your mouth telling your that it is doing too much work. When I had the RPE, eating waa rough. It was like tongue gymnastics, and my mouth would tire easily. The recovery process seems to start from the back teeth and work its way forward, with the front teeth usually being the last to get full feeling back. There is a lot of healing going on in your mouth, I would take it easy and give it a couple more weeks before you get too worried. 16 days is really a short amount of time! Things will start to improve dramatically by about 4-6 weeks.
Hope this helps some!
Brandy
I can't address the pulling feelings specifically, however I do know that when I had my SARPE my front teeth were really tender for quite awhile. At 16 days post op its hard to say, it could just be part of the healing process in that maybe your maxilla is trying to settle into its new position and that cold and hot things cause the muscles to contract which could account for that pulling feeling. It could also be due to your sinuses trying to re-group and heal up. For a long time I could feel a shooting sensation from like right below my left sinus all the way along my top left teeth. It eventually went away as I continued to heal. It took a full 15 months for things to get back to totally normal again, with feeling in my front left incisor being the very last to recover.
You really do want to go kindof easy on the eating thing though. Granted I realize it's hard to eat just smoothies and shakes, but you want to keep it soft for a few weeks. My ortho said it takes 3 months for the bones to fully heal, and while I was eating soft chicken the day of my SARPE, I was careful to keep things soft, like pasta, for a good month afterwards. The sensation you are feeling could also be your mouth telling your that it is doing too much work. When I had the RPE, eating waa rough. It was like tongue gymnastics, and my mouth would tire easily. The recovery process seems to start from the back teeth and work its way forward, with the front teeth usually being the last to get full feeling back. There is a lot of healing going on in your mouth, I would take it easy and give it a couple more weeks before you get too worried. 16 days is really a short amount of time! Things will start to improve dramatically by about 4-6 weeks.
Hope this helps some!
Brandy
Well, everyone, greetings! It was a busy day today. I saw the surgeon at 4:15 and the orthodontist at 4:30 (their offices are right across the hall from each other, thank goodness). So, here's what I know:
The surgeon agrees with me--basically no change. Sigh. slight mobility in the maxilla. He's not really saying much about what he THINKS is going on, but everyone's afraid of getting their hineys sued off these days aren't they? He sent all my records, along with a referral letter to the head of oral/maxillofacial at a major university here. I have an appointment with HIM in two weeks. Then, I see MY surgeon after that. Bottom line--surgeon seems to think that we won't notice any change for another six weeks or so. Fine with me, as long as I have a time frame. I will mark the days on the calendar.
Immediately following that visit, I dashed across the hall to my orthodontists' office (yes, the apostrophe is in the right place--there are TWO of them!). Rookie assistant (hmm) ushers me to my chair, and I ask her if she knows what's going on. She looks sort of puzzled at me. I try to give her the reader's digest version, and say to her, "my maxilla is mobile, I just want to warn you!" This is followed by chuckles from her, and "I think I'll have the orthodontist look at you before we do anything." Wise move, rookie. Orthodontist JR. comes to my chair. He is totally clueless about my case. Evidently orthodontist SR. didn't discuss it with him. Thank God, a) I had seen the surgeon beforehand, and knew specifically what was OK and what was not, and b) that I have educated myself enough to discuss this intelligently with JR. and fill him in (I bet he felt really STUPID not having been apprised of my case--by the way, when I originally scheduled the appointment, I asked the receptionist to check with SR. and make sure that it was OK for me to be seen by JR. Supposedly he said it was fine. My pet peeve...lack of communication. Anyway, once I informed JR. that I have a fibrous union/delayed union/partial union/nonunion (take your pick, everyone else does), and that we are NOT wearing elastics according to surgeon's orders (and SR. agreed to this), the treatment commences with getting rid of my surgical wire up top (HOORAY), and putting in a d-rect, just like the bottom (very flexible, and braided). O-chain back on, wire ties, just like before. We left the bottom alone. Fine with me. I am not anxious for anyone to go gangbusters on my teeth these days!
I was very fortunate (silver lining of my cloudy visits) to get rid of Rookie (she must have been scared out of her britches) and VETERAN assistant with crazy sense of humor and amazing skill steps over to take care of me. God bless her. NOTHING hurt today. She was so careful. And, she even filed off all the sharp ends on my braided wires, so that for the first time in weeks tonight, I am completely comfortable without wearing wax. GOD BLESS VETERAN ASSISTANT! After all, she's been doing her job for over twenty years--in her own words, "I've done this a time or two."
That's all I know for now. For some, it may be TMI, and I hope you skipped to the end, if that's the case. For now, we're playing the waiting game.
The surgeon agrees with me--basically no change. Sigh. slight mobility in the maxilla. He's not really saying much about what he THINKS is going on, but everyone's afraid of getting their hineys sued off these days aren't they? He sent all my records, along with a referral letter to the head of oral/maxillofacial at a major university here. I have an appointment with HIM in two weeks. Then, I see MY surgeon after that. Bottom line--surgeon seems to think that we won't notice any change for another six weeks or so. Fine with me, as long as I have a time frame. I will mark the days on the calendar.
Immediately following that visit, I dashed across the hall to my orthodontists' office (yes, the apostrophe is in the right place--there are TWO of them!). Rookie assistant (hmm) ushers me to my chair, and I ask her if she knows what's going on. She looks sort of puzzled at me. I try to give her the reader's digest version, and say to her, "my maxilla is mobile, I just want to warn you!" This is followed by chuckles from her, and "I think I'll have the orthodontist look at you before we do anything." Wise move, rookie. Orthodontist JR. comes to my chair. He is totally clueless about my case. Evidently orthodontist SR. didn't discuss it with him. Thank God, a) I had seen the surgeon beforehand, and knew specifically what was OK and what was not, and b) that I have educated myself enough to discuss this intelligently with JR. and fill him in (I bet he felt really STUPID not having been apprised of my case--by the way, when I originally scheduled the appointment, I asked the receptionist to check with SR. and make sure that it was OK for me to be seen by JR. Supposedly he said it was fine. My pet peeve...lack of communication. Anyway, once I informed JR. that I have a fibrous union/delayed union/partial union/nonunion (take your pick, everyone else does), and that we are NOT wearing elastics according to surgeon's orders (and SR. agreed to this), the treatment commences with getting rid of my surgical wire up top (HOORAY), and putting in a d-rect, just like the bottom (very flexible, and braided). O-chain back on, wire ties, just like before. We left the bottom alone. Fine with me. I am not anxious for anyone to go gangbusters on my teeth these days!
I was very fortunate (silver lining of my cloudy visits) to get rid of Rookie (she must have been scared out of her britches) and VETERAN assistant with crazy sense of humor and amazing skill steps over to take care of me. God bless her. NOTHING hurt today. She was so careful. And, she even filed off all the sharp ends on my braided wires, so that for the first time in weeks tonight, I am completely comfortable without wearing wax. GOD BLESS VETERAN ASSISTANT! After all, she's been doing her job for over twenty years--in her own words, "I've done this a time or two."
That's all I know for now. For some, it may be TMI, and I hope you skipped to the end, if that's the case. For now, we're playing the waiting game.
Meryaten and Smile2006, thanks for your posts.
I'm trying to laugh, so that I don't cry. I am considering having a conversation with SR. orthodontist about the communication gap. Really, these things are easily taken care of. Just pick up a phone, or in some cases, walk to the next room!
Oh, and by the way, I heard another term for what I have from JR. orthodontist: SPONGY MAXILLA! So, I'm going to have my own animated television show, I think...(Imagine the theme to "Spongebob Squarepants" playing in your head)
Who flops all around when I chew and I bite?
SPONGY MAXILLA!
Who heals for eight weeks and then suddenly's not right?
SPONGY MAXILLA!
Who hates MR. ELASTICS and loves blended food?
SPONGY MAXILLA!
Who's always instable but rarely is rude?
SPONGY MAXILLA, SPONGY MAXILLA, SPONGY...MAXILLA!!! HOORAY!!!
I'm trying to laugh, so that I don't cry. I am considering having a conversation with SR. orthodontist about the communication gap. Really, these things are easily taken care of. Just pick up a phone, or in some cases, walk to the next room!
Oh, and by the way, I heard another term for what I have from JR. orthodontist: SPONGY MAXILLA! So, I'm going to have my own animated television show, I think...(Imagine the theme to "Spongebob Squarepants" playing in your head)
Who flops all around when I chew and I bite?
SPONGY MAXILLA!
Who heals for eight weeks and then suddenly's not right?
SPONGY MAXILLA!
Who hates MR. ELASTICS and loves blended food?
SPONGY MAXILLA!
Who's always instable but rarely is rude?
SPONGY MAXILLA, SPONGY MAXILLA, SPONGY...MAXILLA!!! HOORAY!!!
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SandraJones
- Posts: 333
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:23 am
- Location: Chicago
Oh Phil, you just really need a break here !
I hear you about veteran vs. rookie assistants. I am just into this second -round-of-braces experience and I've already experienced the difference. Separators was the first ... rookie couldn't even get one in properly, veteran stepped in and pop-pop-pop-pop-pop-pop-pop the remaining 7 were in place in a flash. A couple days later I fixed the rookie's separator ! Easier for me to tolerate the rookie because I don't have any underlying worries.
It's bad that you (and I mean you specifically) have to watch their every move and inform them of what's going on when that should already have been communicated to them. Do you ever wonder how other people who are not so assertive (or who are not able to do thorough research) get on in life ???
I hear you about veteran vs. rookie assistants. I am just into this second -round-of-braces experience and I've already experienced the difference. Separators was the first ... rookie couldn't even get one in properly, veteran stepped in and pop-pop-pop-pop-pop-pop-pop the remaining 7 were in place in a flash. A couple days later I fixed the rookie's separator ! Easier for me to tolerate the rookie because I don't have any underlying worries.
It's bad that you (and I mean you specifically) have to watch their every move and inform them of what's going on when that should already have been communicated to them. Do you ever wonder how other people who are not so assertive (or who are not able to do thorough research) get on in life ???
Nov 1960: born
1973 ?: palate expander
1973-1977: braces
Aug 1981: Le Fort I, posterior impaction to correct anterior open bite and class II malocclusion
Aug 2007: braces again to correct various alignment issues and class II malocclusion
1973 ?: palate expander
1973-1977: braces
Aug 1981: Le Fort I, posterior impaction to correct anterior open bite and class II malocclusion
Aug 2007: braces again to correct various alignment issues and class II malocclusion
SandraJones,
It really does make a difference having an experienced assistant.
I don't know how some people survive the healthcare system without the ability to educate themselves and be assertive about their own healthcare. Quite honestly, I think that my surgeon is not used to a patient that demands an intelligent dialogue! He and the orthodontists are getting used to it, though.
I have a friend who works in the healthcare industry (sort of a case manager for a hospice), and she says that they see all sorts of medical mishaps all the time, because of lack of communication and uninformed patients as well as staff. At the beginning of this process, I was determined that I would educate myself as much as possible, and always engage in constructive dialogue with my providers at EVERY visit, even if they resisted, and it was difficult. I am the customer, and I should get what I pay for! Even with all of that, I've still run into all sorts of unforseen issues, and I don't have complete trust of all the people who are caring for me. I think individually, they are all competent in their own areas of expertise, but doing EXCELLENT work always requires one to see the big picture. This is extremely important in surgical ortho cases like mine.
Onward and upward!
It really does make a difference having an experienced assistant.
I don't know how some people survive the healthcare system without the ability to educate themselves and be assertive about their own healthcare. Quite honestly, I think that my surgeon is not used to a patient that demands an intelligent dialogue! He and the orthodontists are getting used to it, though.
I have a friend who works in the healthcare industry (sort of a case manager for a hospice), and she says that they see all sorts of medical mishaps all the time, because of lack of communication and uninformed patients as well as staff. At the beginning of this process, I was determined that I would educate myself as much as possible, and always engage in constructive dialogue with my providers at EVERY visit, even if they resisted, and it was difficult. I am the customer, and I should get what I pay for! Even with all of that, I've still run into all sorts of unforseen issues, and I don't have complete trust of all the people who are caring for me. I think individually, they are all competent in their own areas of expertise, but doing EXCELLENT work always requires one to see the big picture. This is extremely important in surgical ortho cases like mine.
Onward and upward!
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4beauty4symmetry
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 5:58 pm
- Location: boston
I hear ya, Phil, but I'm a bit embarassed to admit I'm just now getting with the program of being my own best advocate.
Problem is, I think the best way to do all 'this' is to become a bit of an autodidact on maxillofacial surgery and orthodontics.
But I can't stand thinking or visualizing this surgery--it gives me the creeps--I also can't stand looking at photographs of the surgery, and am even squeamish about all the photos of people pink open mouths that our ortho comrades in arms illustrate their postings and blogs with.
But I better just . . .get . . . used. . . to. . . it.
Problem is, I think the best way to do all 'this' is to become a bit of an autodidact on maxillofacial surgery and orthodontics.
But I can't stand thinking or visualizing this surgery--it gives me the creeps--I also can't stand looking at photographs of the surgery, and am even squeamish about all the photos of people pink open mouths that our ortho comrades in arms illustrate their postings and blogs with.
But I better just . . .get . . . used. . . to. . . it.
Dec 2006--RPE followed by SARPE surgery
Jan 2007--Braces
Nov 2007 BSSO mandibular setback, genioplasty, and two implant anchors. Surgery-eve reprieve from Lefort.
May 2008--Debraced
Surgeries in Costa Rica, Orthodontics in Massachusetts.
All to fix an openbite, crossbite, underbite, and two missing bottom molars.
Jan 2007--Braces
Nov 2007 BSSO mandibular setback, genioplasty, and two implant anchors. Surgery-eve reprieve from Lefort.
May 2008--Debraced
Surgeries in Costa Rica, Orthodontics in Massachusetts.
All to fix an openbite, crossbite, underbite, and two missing bottom molars.
4beauty4symmetry,
I don't think I could ever envision my OWN surgery--I mean the distance they have to open your mouth and stretch your skin--I can't even let my mind go there but in the most abstract, objective way. It is rather severe surgery, isn't it?
There are very few people in the world with whom I can really discuss the gory details of this process. It's just too grueling to face head on for most folks. Thank goodness for Archwired!
I don't think I could ever envision my OWN surgery--I mean the distance they have to open your mouth and stretch your skin--I can't even let my mind go there but in the most abstract, objective way. It is rather severe surgery, isn't it?
There are very few people in the world with whom I can really discuss the gory details of this process. It's just too grueling to face head on for most folks. Thank goodness for Archwired!
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SandraJones
- Posts: 333
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:23 am
- Location: Chicago
I've had lots of experiences where if I hadn't done my own research and insisted that the docs apply logic I would have thought I had diseases that I actually didn't have or taken medications that were ineffective or simply inappropriate.
One time a doc diagnosed me with a non-fatal but serious illness without running any tests. Her diagnosis didn't make sense to me because I was missing the hallmark symptoms. She wrote me a prescription for a drug but I didn't fill it. I did my own research and found out that a test was available. At the next appointment she chided me for not taking the drug. I asked for the test and she balked, until I threatened to report her. Several days later I came home from work and found a nonchalant message on my answering machine from the doc stating that the test result was negative, i.e., her diagnosis was wrong. She didn't even apologize. She just said if I had any questions I should call. I did report her but nothing came of it. It makes me sick to think that if I hadn't done my research or insisted that I be properly tested, I would probably to this day be taking a drug that I didn't need to take, which probably caused side effect that I would have been suffering needlessly.
Spongy maxilla ... I'm going to have that running through my head all day !!
One time a doc diagnosed me with a non-fatal but serious illness without running any tests. Her diagnosis didn't make sense to me because I was missing the hallmark symptoms. She wrote me a prescription for a drug but I didn't fill it. I did my own research and found out that a test was available. At the next appointment she chided me for not taking the drug. I asked for the test and she balked, until I threatened to report her. Several days later I came home from work and found a nonchalant message on my answering machine from the doc stating that the test result was negative, i.e., her diagnosis was wrong. She didn't even apologize. She just said if I had any questions I should call. I did report her but nothing came of it. It makes me sick to think that if I hadn't done my research or insisted that I be properly tested, I would probably to this day be taking a drug that I didn't need to take, which probably caused side effect that I would have been suffering needlessly.
Spongy maxilla ... I'm going to have that running through my head all day !!
Nov 1960: born
1973 ?: palate expander
1973-1977: braces
Aug 1981: Le Fort I, posterior impaction to correct anterior open bite and class II malocclusion
Aug 2007: braces again to correct various alignment issues and class II malocclusion
1973 ?: palate expander
1973-1977: braces
Aug 1981: Le Fort I, posterior impaction to correct anterior open bite and class II malocclusion
Aug 2007: braces again to correct various alignment issues and class II malocclusion
SandraJones,
Scary story about that diagnosis. Sadly enough, things like that happen all the time.
I am going to my second opinion appointment on the 24th, armed with lots of information and loads of questions. Hopefully, I'll walk away having gained some information about my case.
This is the first time in my life that I have ever done this much medical research for myself, but I've never needed it before. All of my medical issues up until now have been minor ones which seem to resolve themselves in time. Until last summer, when I had my SARPE, I had not had surgery of any kind since the age of TWO, when I had a tonsillectomy.
Onward and upward!
Scary story about that diagnosis. Sadly enough, things like that happen all the time.
I am going to my second opinion appointment on the 24th, armed with lots of information and loads of questions. Hopefully, I'll walk away having gained some information about my case.
This is the first time in my life that I have ever done this much medical research for myself, but I've never needed it before. All of my medical issues up until now have been minor ones which seem to resolve themselves in time. Until last summer, when I had my SARPE, I had not had surgery of any kind since the age of TWO, when I had a tonsillectomy.
Onward and upward!