Jaw expansion. Damon or expander?

[thegra]

Hello.
I am a 20 year old male (although i do look younger)
I have been a mouth breather for years, until June when i was operated, and now i can breathe through my nose just fine.
All these years of mouth breathing has cause a bad development of my jaw. My upper arch is narrow.
As a matter of fact, now that im breathing through my nose and my tongue is in the correct position, I can feel my own tongue acting as an expander for my upper arch. believe it or not, i can feel its pressure, since it is too big for my upper jaw.
In these 6 months that i am breathing normally, i think i have seen a minimal growth of my jaw. Nothing drastic but i believe it is there.

Now that my breathing is right , i wish to get orthodontic treatment. My main concern is not to have straight teeth when i smile. I want my jaws to develop as close as possible to what they would be had i breathed properly all these years. This means wider jaw , some growth of the jaws to the front, wider cheekbones-skull in general.

I have done some research and seen my options.
I am not willing to undergo surgery, i believe the results may be even better without it , if the expansion is slow like natural growth would be, and not sudden.

So these are the 2 ways I could go with:
1.Palatal expansion (non surgical) + braces
2.Damon braces (no expander) In this case i will rely on the force from my tongue to help the expansion, which may or may not be enough

Question 1:Which way do you believe would achieve better expansion results?
Question 2:Does wearing an expander allow your tongue to be positioned on your upper jaw as normal? Because i believe force from my tongue could allow a forward growth which would be desirable i believe.
Question 3:Is there an expander which pushes the jaw not only to widen but also forward? Ive only seen this one (named homeoblock) but it seems it is innovative and not widely used. Is there anything similar?

PS: sorry if this is posted in the wrong section, I was not quite sure where i should post it..

[rhomboid]

Modern biowires broaden arches regardless whether they are attached to Damon brackets or not; eventhough Damon brags to such claim. You need to go to an Orthodontist to have your question properly answered, they will do that as a consultation free the first time. Good luck.

[thegra]

Thank you for your reply.

Do you believe these biowires have a certain limit of expansion they can achieve? In such a case maybe an expander would be preferable?

I will indeed consult an orthodontist in person, which i have already done in the past for informative reasons.

[TumbleDryLow]

You have asked many questions that only an orthodontist could answer with any real authority. But I did want to comment on the narrow upper arch/expansion issue as I dealt with something very similar.
From everything that I have read, we usually only have until 18 years of age to do palatal expansion without the assistance of surgery. By 18 (give or take--you are close at only 20) the bony structures of the palate are fused together. You say that you feel as if your tongue is acting like an expander. You may want to consider though that your tongue (which is crazy strong) is tipping your molars outward. This tipping is what happens most times when an adult gets an expander (like I did). Nothing happens with the bones--they are fused and stay just the way they are, but the molars tip outward giving the impression that there is expansion going on.
I say this with a grain of salt as I have seen a few posts here on the boards where people swear they have gotten true widening of the palatal bones as an adult with just an expander. But honestly, given the results you desire, I really think surgery is going to be the best option for you. Barring that, I'd say to try expansion without the surgery with an orthodontist that you trust and who will be completely up-front with the pros and cons of doing this, and who will explain (preferably with photos of former patients) the best and worst case scenarios you can expect. Keep us posted.

[thegra]

I have read about a few cases of adult palate expansion without surgery. It seems to be pretty new and not common practice, but it seems it can work, at least for some people.

edit: not that I am an expert, but didn't this guys arch expand?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLlZ3qJoR1E

[TumbleDryLow]

edit: not that I am an expert, but didn't this guys arch expand?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLlZ3qJoR1E

I'm not an expert either, but yes, his arch did expand. But...I think we are operating under different definitions for certain terms. "Palatal Expansion" (to me anyway) is literally the movement of palatal bones into a new or wider shape. "Arch Expansion" as you speak of here is just the moving of teeth to straighten out the arc of the teeth thus giving a proper (and usually wider) looking smile. Nothing happened to the palatal bones in this example. I guess I was confused about the result you were seeking. If your case is similar to the video, then I think you can simply use braces to straighten out the arches of your teeth. The guy in the video looks to have a normal arch width. He just has some crowding. Once the crowding is corrected, the end result is a fuller-looking arch. But if you want your jaw bones to actually expand, that's where it gets hazy as to how much, if any, is possible without surgery.

[BracketRacket]

So these are the 2 ways I could go with:
1.Palatal expansion (non surgical) + braces
2.Damon braces (no expander) In this case i will rely on the force from my tongue to help the expansion, which may or may not be enough

If your palate is narrow enough (in comparison with your lower jaw), none of the above will work, unless the all of the "expansion" you need is tipping of teeth outwards. If the suture between the halves of your palate has closed, there is no way to widen without surgery to split the suture. You can only move teeth within the structure of bone, and if your palate/jaw is not wide enough to put the teeth into proper arch alignment, to "fix" them requires surgery. Expanders can be used in certain situations to help, but primarily tip teeth outwards past a certain age. Certainly, force from your tongue is not going to widen your palate in any way, shape or form.

Please see an ortho if you are worried, to discuss your concerns/options. It is possible that what you see/disgnose may not be at all what they would diagnose and recommend treatment for. Without getting a proper evaluation, all you are doing is driving yourself batty with possibilities that may or may not even occur.

[lajuana483]

I have been looking for someone that has used the Homeoblock, I can't even find anyone that has even heard of it. I have been told that I need teeth pulled and I am not sure that this is the right answer, so after much research I am going to make an appointment with an Orthodontist that uses the Homeoblock device. I will post after the appointment and let you know what he says. From what I have read, it is possible for adults to expand the palate without surgery. Also, this device is worn mostly at night and also straightens teeth!! I am hoping that this will be the answer for me, I am 47 yrs....I have wanted straight teeth my whole life, but I want to make sure that I make the right decisions.

[crazybeautiful]

I'm with those who have explained the need for surgery before any significant expansion can take place. Think of it with this analogy: if you have a brick, you can try and pull it apart all you want, but it's not going to change the structure of the brick.

If you have a significantly narrow upper jaw, you can't achieve any significant change with a non-surgical expander.

And in the end, I would imagine non-surgical 'expansion' would be a much harder thing to deal with than actually having surgery. Put some nerves in that brick and try to pull it apart - and I imagine it won't be pain-free! (though I haven't experienced it so can't comment officially on that)

Here is my result from surgical expansion. I expanded 10mm, and trust me, that is not possible without surgery
So of course it depends how much expansion you need. Though the chances are if your top jaw is narrow enough to cause you trouble, it is bad enough to require surgery


http://crazybeautifulsurgery.blogspot.c ... yikes.html