Rotating Canines

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#1 Post by **fred** » Tue Sep 02, 2008 9:43 am

Has anyone had an upper canine rotated successfully with Invisalign (without ending up in fixed braces)? Thanks for any responses

#2 Post by **larma** » Tue Sep 02, 2008 5:30 pm

I was told they could not rotate a tooth, just align the teeth. That is why I ended up with metal mouth...

but I only went to two ortho's to discuss, and both were not big supporters of invisalign, even though they used both traditional braces and invisalign.

#3 Post by **fred** » Tue Sep 02, 2008 9:13 pm

I guess it's not looking good. Thanks for your responses. I wish the orthodontist would've told me this.

I saw him once during the course of my first set of aligners. He wasn't even there to look at my teeth when I was done and being fit for refinement aligners. The dental assistant copied my questions so the doctor could look at them, but I doubt he will.

#4 Post by **swedishsmile** » Wed Sep 03, 2008 4:51 am

Hi!

I had my canine (lower arch however) rotated. I guess its root is not as big as the upper arch but anyway, it was rotated. I had two attachments on the tooth, both on the outside and the inside of it.

#5 Post by **PaulInc** » Wed Sep 03, 2008 9:14 am

@swedishsmile

How many degree was your lower canine rotated? One of my lowers needs rotating quite a bit and i am interested to know.

One of my upper canines needs rotation too, but it's only a few tiny degree over the full course of my treatment (12 months), so i dont anticipate it being a problem.

#6 Post by **fred** » Wed Sep 03, 2008 11:20 am

Thanks for your response swedishsmile. I am glad to hear that you had success with rotating your canine. It gives me hope!
PaulInc, I have an upper canine that needed a lot of rotation and it was moved some during my set of 18 top aligners. The aligners stopped fitting at the end and it didn't move anymore. I am waiting on my refinement trays now. I will keep you posted on the final result.

#7 Post by **John37** » Wed Sep 03, 2008 8:27 pm

You can look at my clincheck links in my signature to see what I'm going to explain. One of my top canines had an attachment and is rotating. I'm on 26 of 28 now with no problem on that tooth. The rotation is very gradual compared to the movement of other upper teeth.

I don't know if the lower canines are easier to rotate, but both of mine needed a lot of rotation. (See the clincheck.) I have hooks on the lower canines and elastic bands to help them rotate and pull my lower teeth back a bit.

The problem I've had is some of my upper premolars were supposed to get pulled down, but haven't come down. They no longer fit the attachments. So at least in my case, it seems that rotations were the easier movement.

#8 Post by **swedishsmile** » Thu Sep 04, 2008 12:23 am

PaulInc:

I don't know how many degrees it was rotated. It started in a position where it was parallell to the 2nd incisor and was rotated to follow the arch. A (very) rough estimate would be 15-20 degrees. It required 12 aligners. I started having only 1 attachment (on the outside) but it was a bit troublesome to move it that way. Then I got an attachment on the inside of the tooth as well which caused the tooth to move as expected.

#9 Post by **PaulInc** » Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:04 am

@John
You look like you're having about 70+ deg rotation there, and yours was rotated in the opposite direction to mine. I think i'll need < 40 deg rotation.

@swedishsmile
I don't have any space at the back of my lower canine for another attachment until it's moved out a bit. I shall have see if i too require additional attachments at some point. My rotation sounds like it's about twice as much as yours, but my treatment time is also twice as long.

#10 Post by **Wobblydeb** » Thu Sep 04, 2008 8:30 am

I have a massive amount of rotation to achieve on one upper canine (right hand side in this screenshot). In my Clincheck video it is obvious that about the last half of my 31 upper trays are trying to bring that canine around. All the other teeth complete their movement long before that one!

As I'm only on tray 3 I cannot say how successful it is so far - I'll let you know as I go though

[URL=http://www.4shared.com/file/617190 ... .jpg[/img]

#11 Post by **John37** » Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:20 pm

PaulInc wrote:@John
You look like you're having about 70+ deg rotation there, and yours was rotated in the opposite direction to mine. I think i'll need < 40 deg rotation.

I don't think my lower canines rotate that much. I think it's more like 45 degrees.

My first 5 lower trays weren't designed to move the canines at all. But once they started rotating on tray 6 the effects have been dramatic. It seems like every tray, just a small rotation makes a big difference. My canines used to stick out like fangs. They were in front of the upper teeth when my jaws were together...looked terrible in pictures.

I hope you have just as dramatic an effect with your treatment.

#12 Post by **Over50** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 10:54 am

Only the lower canine needed to be rotated, and I am on tray 16 of 26 for the lowers. That canine seems to be rotating as planned (there is an attachment on it), but the lower arch premolar on the other side does not seem to be rotating as well. I didn't have any on the top that needed to be rotated, so I cannot report on top canines. Good luck with your top ones.

#13 Post by **Ems** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 1:23 pm

Just wondering i know you have mentioned about rotating the canine but can you rotate the lateral incisor as both of mine are twisted?

Thanks

#14 Post by **swedishsmile** » Sun Sep 07, 2008 11:50 pm

@ems

My guess is that they would be easier to rotate than the caninces since the roots of the lateral incisors are smaller.

#15 Post by **John37** » Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:23 am

Ems wrote:Just wondering i know you have mentioned about rotating the canine but can you rotate the lateral incisor as both of mine are twisted?

Thanks

One of my upper lateral incisors is rotating and trying to come forward between the adjacent teeth. But in the last couple months it's also getting pushed up into the gums also, so it's not all the way down in the aligner anymore.

I don't have an attachment on it, but I suspect I will need on on my refinements. So I think any tooth can potentially be rotated, it just may take some attachments.